> > I personally think the USA is in bad need of new genetics from abroad to 
> > get some vigor back in our bees.

> Not really, there is enough good genetics left if one knows where to look 
> here in N. America and around the USA.

Seems there was a recent survey of US honey bee genes, comparing now and 
sometime earlier, which showed a loss of quite a number of genes, but also 
an introduction of a somewhat similar number of new ones.  I don't recall 
the details, but maybe someone has the details at hand.

New material originated, seems to me, from Australian and New Zealand 
imports -- directly, and via Canada or Mexico over the past decades.  (The 
latter countries share long land borders in prime bee terrain which are not 
particularly respected by flying bees and have different import regulations 
from the US)

Also, some new genes came with the Primorsky stock , and, I seem to have 
heard that there are importations of germ plasm in various forms permitted 
for various reasons.

Moreover, I am sure others have arrived with many undeclared private imports 
to the USA, Mexico, and Canada by beekeepers, and perhaps, even occasional 
researchers.

Of course, the big story over recent decades is the new genes which 
originated from Kerr's various famous and less known importations and 
shipments to various parts of the hemisphere.

> It's just not common channels used by most beekeepers,

That is an interesting, if somewhat cryptic string of words.  Not sure what 
these "channels" are, and hopefully Dee will explain, but I don't think 
there a lot of secrets out there, or much of significance that the survey 
missed.

I could be wrong, and would love to see the proof.

> and may take a little work and thought relative to wholebee 
> breeding/looking at things.

If this is true, maybe an explanation of what specific work and thought is 
in order and what "wholebee" means and if that is relevant to the question.

As for the need for more new genetics, to obtain 'vigor', that is an 
interesting and possibly controversial topic.   For one thing, the specific 
genetics that would/might provide vigor need to be identified, as well as 
the unintended consequences, if any, of any new introduction considered. 
Kerr's introductions, along with, reportedly, Tabor's have had very 
far-reaching adverse effects on both beekeeping and the general population. 
Other importations have had less of an obvious impact.

There are, indeed, probably quite a few stocks out in the rest of the world 
somewhere that might make some contribution.  Is that contribution 
predictable, or economically significant?  Good question.

Interestingly, I recently attended a talk by a BEE-L member mentioning some 
_Chilean_ stock apparently in commercial use in the Peace River country.  It 
was of interest in the talk because it was more AFB resistant than any of 
the other stock in the test, including the Peace River selected stock, and, 
I believe NWCs, but I said myself, "Huh! Chlean stock in Canada?"  Things 
keep changing.

So, we are seeing a flux of genetics through the Americas, and 
interestingly, genetics do not just form one large homogenous pool, but tend 
to follow routes -- both natural and asphalt -- and vary over regions. 
Moreover, some genes intermix better than others.  It is a complex and dimly 
understood topic.

Where bees are left to their own devices, populations will stabilize and 
adapt to localities, with specific genetics in each region, but with human 
management, breeding and transport, there are numerous competing agendas and 
techniques of selection, resulting in genetic combinations that might not 
have evolved 'naturally', and which may not be particularly fit or stable 
with unnatural concentrations and distribution.

New techniques for quickly and simply identifying specific genetics and 
associating traits with them will vastly accelerate this divide between 
'natural', and managed populations.

Are more genes and new genes required?  Depends which genes, and what they 
are known to contribute -- both beneficial and suspicious -- and what other 
new genes they bring along with them, if any.

allen
---
We are at the very beginning of time for the human race. It is not 
unreasonable that we grapple with problems. But there are tens of thousands 
of years in the future. Our responsibility is to do what we can, learn what 
we can, improve the solutions, and pass them on. - Richard Feynman (1918 - 
1988)


 

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