Oh!, and now we someone who has something against old women :-)
 
> ----------
> From:         Edd Chamberlin[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To:     Discussion of Bee Biology
> Sent:         Saturday, November 01, 1997 3:38 PM
> To:   [log in to unmask]
> Subject:      Re: [Fwd: [Fwd: Very Agressive WORN OUT THE SEQUEL!!]]
>
> You people sound like a bunch of  old women!!
>
>
> On Sat, 1 Nov 1997 00:05:08 -0600 "Marlin (SCOTT) Kline"
> <[log in to unmask]> writes:
> >ANDY IF YOU POSSIBLY HAVE GIVEN THOUGHT THAT WAS A LOVE LETTER FROM
> >KATHY YOU ARE
> >PROBABLY GETTING WARM FUZZES ABOUT NOW FROM THE LETTER I SENT YOU
> >YOU ARE A MUCH LARGER A$$HOLE THAN YOU GIVE YOURSELF CREDIT FOR."
> >IMHO" MAYBE YOU
> >SHOULD CONSIDER ANOTHER LIST TO SUBSCRIBE TO~~~~~~~~~ttyl~~~~~~
> >the bee cop with the badge and in some
> >areas a gun dressed in his green
> >suit.
> >
> >Andy Nachbar wrote:
> >
> >> Hello Kathy and thanks for the Love Letter, I am sorry that you
> have
> >such a
> >> low personal opinion of my posts and I am sure you are not alone. I
> >will
> >> try to do better in the future as I surely do not know it all and
> >have room
> >> for some improvement in my life.
> >>
> >> I will make a few points since I have rung your bell I might as
> well
> >add to
> >> your lists of personal grievances. If you are not interested you
> are
> >free
> >> and welcome to add me to your reader's byte bucket list and should
> >do it
> >> now before reading any farther.
> >>
> >> (EXIT NOW)
> >>
> >> 1st and most important I have always been up front with what I post
> >and I
> >> always try to impress all readers that what I post is "in my own
> >humble
> >> opinion" (IMHO), and what I write should not be taken as anything
> >more then
> >> the Bee Gospel according to my own experiences from a lifetime
> >within the
> >> Beekeeping Industry and in my own beehives and many others. I am
> >sure
> >> other's may have done the time but I would not expect them to have
> >the same
> >> opinion's or express them in the same style as I do, if at all,
> >that's life..
> >>
> >> I do pride myself on being honest and truthful in what I say but
> >admit that
> >> I use a style of writing that I hope makes other's think and in no
> >way is
> >> intended to do any more then cause all to read what I write. I do
> >not write
> >> the politically correct post as anyone can see. It may be seen as
> >> aggressive by some, but other's take a certain amount of pride to
> >have been
> >> the subject of one of my so called report's and some do make
> changes
> >> because of them and many of these victims are in real life
> >considered my
> >> friends. Maybe it is a painful learning process which is the norm
> >when
> >> working with bees or the Internet. Everyone who read's what I write
> >is free
> >> to e-mail any challenge to what I post and they do and I have at
> >times
> >> admitted I was wrong in my opinion's which have not been cast in
> >stone or
> >> handed down from above.
> >>
> >> Some feeling and ego's do get bruised but that is the nature of
> this
> >thing
> >> we call language and the impersonal nature of the Internet's news
> >groups,
> >> list mail, and e-mail,.. most experienced readers and posters do
> not
> >and
> >> should not take what anyone write's as personal. I am sorry for
> >those who
> >> do shed a tear because they felt they were personally attacked and
> >can only
> >> say to them it's a two way street of experience and if anyone feels
> >they
> >> were personally offended they are free here to express their own
> >opinions.
> >> A common mistake that we all make and that is reading something
> into
> >> other's post that was not intended by the sender. I do not have
> time
> >for
> >> personal fights or personal attack's in my life's work, but know
> >that my
> >> style of writing can be the subject of mis interpretation by those
> >who may
> >> read what I write, not all do as many do not like long winded posts
> >or
> >> posts that ramble, both are the norm for me, and all are welcome
> not
> >to
> >> read them.
> >>
> >> I don't expect many to agree with what I write and yet every week I
> >am
> >> asked for permission to use what I have written in one way or
> >another and
> >> this gives me the warm fuzzes but also does surprise me and I have
> >without
> >> effort, other then what is required to make a post, became one the
> >most
> >> quoted beekeepers on the world wide net. I don't know if this is
> >good, but
> >> for sure many want to read what I have to say and are not turned
> off
> >by how
> >> I say it and find my effort's worthwhile or they would not be
> making
> >the
> >> efforts to add my words to their own web pages, newsletter's, real
> >> newspaper's, books, and other not so friendly places.
> >>
> >> Anyway I am in no way offended when other's don't agree with me
> >personally
> >> and welcome and encourage all to express their own opinions and I
> do
> >not
> >> judge anyone because he or she has expressed a differing opinion or
> >do I
> >> try to belittle those who ask questions as I found out a long time
> >ago the
> >> only bad question is the one that was not asked and believe it or
> >not I
> >> learn by what other's ask. I have personally set up a "auto
> >responder" for
> >> new bee's who want some basic information and it is well used to
> the
> >point
> >> that I seldom mention it as it costs me dearly, but thankfully
> >others have
> >> followed my lead and several "auto responders" are now installed on
> >the
> >> Internet for beekeeper's use.
> >>
> >> I also believe that "if you can do it better then I, then have at
> >it!". I
> >> personally plan on continuing with my own efforts as long as I am
> >able as I
> >> have a lot to say and have just began to say it.
> >>
> >> >I wouldn't worry about it. It sounds like you did the right
> things,
> >if
> >> >anything you erred to the side of caution and IMHO, that is a good
> >> >thing.
> >>
> >> What was that you say, someone may have errored.., IMHO it was one
> >error
> >> that so many beekeepers, new and old make, and that is looking to
> >> government to solve a common everyday beekeeping problem.
> >>
> >> >As for Andy Nachbaur's other comments about  "Afro Bee Slash and
> >Burn"
> >> >"quarantine boss with star and gun at the ready"; it appears to me
> >that
> >> >Andy has some problem with the current method of quarantine being
> >used
> >> >in this country to attempt to stop/slow the spread of african
> >honeybees
> >>
> >> Yes, this includes ALL US bee quarantines which have done nothing
> to
> >stop,
> >> slow down or cure any beekeeping problem and in fact have ruined
> the
> >lives
> >> of so many good beekeepers and their families who were no different
> >from
> >> anyone else on this earth other then to have been the victims of
> the
> >zeal
> >> of others. At least one death can be pointed out as a direct result
> >of one
> >> of the bee quarantines though not from a gun shot or bee stings but
> >a
> >> broken heart and many others have suffered such a degree of damage
> >that no
> >> amount of liberal rhetoric can ever make them whole again or will I
> >ever
> >> personally forgive those whom I know were responsible or those in
> >positions
> >> of responsibility who did nothing but fan the fires knowing all
> >along that
> >> it was wrong. The US bee quarantines have been so bad that even the
> >US
> >> government agency that was responsible for them now uses them as an
> >example
> >> of what not to do in their internal training operations. Even the
> >AHB
> >> guarantee is due to expire because the science behind it is so poor
> >that
> >> any lower court challenge would end it anyway.(IMHO)
> >>
> >> >I recall an earlier post in which he advises someone looking for
> >African
> >> >honeybee stock to breed in the US, that he contact some of the
> guys
> >behind
> >> >quarantine lines to get AHB breeding stock.
> >>
> >> I did that? It is my own opinion that since we have AHB we should
> >take our
> >> heads out of our sand boxes., It is time we got to know our bees
> >including
> >> the AHB personally and up close and work and use them, not as
> attack
> >dogs,
> >> but use some of their well known productive qualities to make
> >improvement
> >> to most any stock now in this country. We don't have to import them
> >via
> >> some government program as they are here now in abundance, nor do
> we
> >have
> >> to relied on the judgement of persons with nothing to gain or lose
> >in
> >> choosing the right stock for ourselves. Believe it or not many
> >beekeepers
> >> in the US are doing what I have suggested above and they do live
> >with fear,
> >> and that's not right. Man or beekeepers should have the right to
> use
> >what
> >> God has provided without fear of punishment or destruction from his
> >fellow
> >> man the bee cop with the badge and in some areas a gun dressed in
> >his green
> >> suit.
> >>
> >> Well for a fact if there are so called quarantine lines they have
> >not kept
> >> beekeepers from moving in and out of these areas such as bees from
> >Texas
> >> and other states known to have AHB, (now including California, an
> >infested
> >> state) and these same bees can be found in both the South, East,
> >West and
> >> North and have not caused any reported problems and have added to
> >the
> >> wealth of this county with honey production and pollination of many
> >> agricultural crops, then what good are quarantines other then to
> >provide
> >> employment to government people whom could be doing other more
> >productive
> >> things like checking meat for bad smells or bugs and chemicals.
> >>
> >> >I figured when no one blasted him for that (IMO irresponsible)
> >post,
> >> >that most everyone here on BEE-L had come to appreciate Andy for
> >his
> >> >forwarding of other peoples info, press releases, etc. but had
> >learned
> >> >to ignore much of what  he personally had to say
> >>
> >> >(I was lucky to have been forewarned).
> >>
> >> You may have been the victim of some poor information but you make
> >it sound
> >> like there is a "Kill the OLd Drone Club".<G> But as long as you
> >read what
> >> I write I believe in time you may with real time beekeeping
> >experience have
> >> a somewhat more moderate opinion on ignoring what I and other
> >commercial
> >> beekeepers have to say and may even change your open personal
> >attacks on my
> >> own opinions and my posts made at great personal investment and
> >without
> >> expectations of rewards or even the recovery of out of pocket
> costs.
> >>
> >> I seldom blow my own horn like this but I take great pride in the
> >numbers
> >> of people who over the years have taken the time to come up to me
> >> personally, sometimes years later, and tell me how that at one time
> >they
> >> thought I had one wheel off the track but they have with experience
> >changed
> >> their own opinion's and think it is important enough to personally
> >tell me
> >> that I was on the right track all the time. This is the only real
> >reward I
> >> get for my personal public efforts and does make it worthwhile and
> >calms my
> >> own fears and cold chills I get when so many times I have stood up
> >alone
> >> before National and State Beekeeping groups, University Boards, the
> >> Legislature's, and the Court's, trying in my own way to protect
> >myself and
> >> my industry from those who would do us as individuals under by
> >telling it
> >> in my own way as I see it and it has worked well and I would be
> >happy to
> >> give you details but will not take the time now. I have always
> >included all
> >> beekeepers in my efforts and do not judge individuals by the number
> >of bees
> >> they have or the reason they have them or even what they post to
> >newsgroups
> >> or list mailers but I read them all as time permits and even the
> >personal
> >> Love Letters from other readers.
> >>
> >> IMHO, ttul, the OLd Drone
> >
>