LACTNET Archives

Lactation Information and Discussion

LACTNET@COMMUNITY.LSOFT.COM

Options: Use Forum View

Use Monospaced Font
Show Text Part by Default
Show All Mail Headers

Message: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Topic: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Author: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]

Print Reply
Subject:
From:
Lisa Marasco IBCLC <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
Lactation Information and Discussion <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Tue, 6 Jan 2004 20:01:39 -0800
Content-Type:
text/plain
Parts/Attachments:
text/plain (116 lines)
Jeans asks about goat's rue. I have done my own research and also found
that information is fairly scarce. Goat's Rue is not very well known
outside of lactation, and even within lactation it is not very well
known. A medline review of 'galegas oficinalis' will reveal that there
actually have been several articles written about goat's rue in the past
decades, and they mostly examine the galactogogue properties as well as
toxicity concerns due to animal reports. I have not run across much
officially discussing goat's rue use in person.

I first became aware of goat's rue's reputation as a galactogogue while
searching for additional help for a mom with insufficient glandular
tissue and insufficient milk supply. Patricia Drazin and Mechell Turner
both recommended it as a good choice for that situation, and it was from
them that I first learned of the reputation for increasing breast
tissue. The hard part has been that, as noted, there has been no
research in this area, and so we rely mainly on anecdotes.

I had tried goat's rue tincture in several moms with poorly developed
breasts and poor supply, dosing 3-4 times a day, but had not seen much
in results. Then, a couple of years ago, I had a very motivated mom with
tubular breasts and low supply who decided on her own to up the dosage.
She took both More Milk Plus and Goat's Rue (both from Motherlove
Herbal) aggressively, as often as she nursed, about 8-10 times a day,
and did so for several weeks. In the first couple of weeks we had modest
increases, but after about 6 weeks her supply was up to 95% of baby's
needs. We had started out supplementing something like 25-30 oz a day
and got down to 3oz a day, which was amazing.

Even more amazing, her breasts filled out. Her midwife had originally
referred her to me and told me that her breasts "looked terrible, like
dog ears."  When mom returned for her 6 wk postpartum check up, she
gasped to the mother, "Oh my God, you have breasts!"  These breasts,
which changed very little during pregnancy and the first week
postpartum, slowly developed and grew in capacity and production. I have
pictures that I now share in presentations of the difference. While this
is not a nice, accurate scientific study and there may be confounding
variables, both the mom and I feel strongly that goat's rue, dosed more
aggressively, has made a difference.

This mom had a second baby in September, having conceived while nursing
her firstborn, who was 9 mos at conception. Even though she was nursing,
her supply dropped during pregnancy, and when baby #1 weaned completely,
the breasts really "deflated" and did not grow during the pregnancy.  We
ended up with exactly the same scenario with number two, very little
milk to start with (baby transferring 10-14 ccs at day 12) and a lot of
work to bring in a milk supply. I had hoped that the first baby would
have led to a better start the second time, but it did not. We got mom
up to about 95%, but she was very tired of taking the herbs so
frequently, so we decided to try a different tack and switch to
domperidone in the hope that it would sustain what the herbs started and
allow her to take something only 3 or 4 times a day. At first it seemed
to work, but after a few days the supply began to decrease, and I
documented drops in intake (50%) and diaper output that alarmed me.
Rather than going back completely to what we were doing before, we
decided to add back just the goat's rue, 5-6 times a day. Within a
couple of days mom began to experience more fullness and more milk
again, and we have just about stabilized her at that 95% place again.
Mom commented to me that she could "really tell the difference with the
goat's rue; it's like her breasts just fill up."

Right now, mom finds that her supply is naturally most abundant in the
morning, so she takes one 10mg pill of domperidone in the morning, 2
later on, then 3 and 3 (or 4), for a total of 9-10 pills a day. Then she
takes the goat's rue about 6 times a day. This seems to be a good
combination, and she will eventually wean back when she can. This is a
case study of one mom and two babies, and though the application may be
limited, I am encouraged.

As an aside: a local herb and vitamin store opened up recently, and I
went in to meet with the owner and ask her to carry the Motherlove
products. When I explained to her "why" goat's rue, she was very
intrigued, also informing me that saw palmetto also had a similar
reputation for increasing breast tissue. She is a body builder and did
not have a lot of breast tissue, so she decided to try it on herself.
She and her husband reported back to me that she experienced an increase
in breast size, and that her assistant also decided to try it and has
had the same experience. They are pretty impressed with the stuff. ;-)
BTW: fenugreek is also reported to help increase breast tissue according
to some sources, but that reputation is not nearly as strong as for
goat's rue.

I would love to see some official research done on goat's rue for both
glandular growth and increasing milk production. Unfortunately, there is
pretty much nothing in the literature right now. If I were to do a
study, I would love to try three scenarios. The first would be
non-pregnant women, to see if it causes increase in size. The second
would be in established lactation situations where a mom is pumping
(such as a working mom with regular hours) to look for measurable
increases over the norm, and the third would be to compare response for
poor lactation between fenugreek and goat's rue. It is almost impossible
to realistically construct a tight study because there are variables
that are difficult to control, but I think we could still learn some
good things from what we can do.

Sheila Humphrey (IBCLC) has published a new book called "The Nursing
Mother's Herbal" that gives information on goat's rue, including its use
in other countries. She has devised a safety rating for herbs similar to
what Tom Hale has, and rates Goat's Rue as a "B" on a 5 letter scale.
Sheila has done a lot of research for her book and knows more about the
available literature on herbal galactogogues than anyone else I know.  I
would recommend her book as a good place to start.

~Lisa Marasco

             ***********************************************

To temporarily stop your subscription: set lactnet nomail
To start it again: set lactnet mail (or digest)
To unsubscribe: unsubscribe lactnet
All commands go to [log in to unmask]

The LACTNET mailing list is powered by L-Soft's renowned
LISTSERV(R) list management software together with L-Soft's LSMTP(R)
mailer for lightning fast mail delivery. For more information, go to:
http://www.lsoft.com/LISTSERV-powered.html

ATOM RSS1 RSS2