> > >None of this in any way proves to me that the brood problem was caused by > either viruses or mites. That brood looks like EFB to me. Similar to EFB, but with small differences. We saw a lot of these signs some years ago, and there may well be some of the same bacteria involved. The slumping of the larvae is different than with typical EFB. What I see more often with PMS are propupae, lying flat, heads upturned, somewhat similar to sacbrood. They are melanized. And also freshly-uncapped dead early pupal stages, again melanized. I agree with Pete--these signs are very common with high varroa loads. -- Randy Oliver Grass Valley, CA www.ScientificBeekeeping.com *********************************************** The BEE-L mailing list is powered by L-Soft's renowned LISTSERV(R) list management software. For more information, go to: http://www.lsoft.com/LISTSERV-powered.html