Responding to Eric, Not sure if the last letter went thru. Here it is again Quotes ommited. So you dislike the way small cell advocates define organic. But you choose to call this "hijacked" You also dislike the way the NOS has defined organic,,, BUT you do not label this "hijacked"?????? That's how chemicals creep into organics, where they do not belong. The "it's more humane to treat" and not let bees or the poor beekeeper suffer. Agree! But it's the way I keep bees,,, and I walk my talk. A big cause bad past breeding practices. And there are MANY, MANY more cures and reasons. IMO, small cell accounts for only a part of the cure. I'll back you up! Same as many here are passionate about their breeding methods and the queens they raise, and promote it as the way bees should be kept and bred. Small cellers are also passionate about organic beekeeping and express the same passion in talking organics. I do not accuse others on this list of hijacking "methods of keeping and breeding bees", nor do I use such terms or name calling when describing their methodry. Are you really organic if you are treating your hives for pests? If you look at Webster's definition, this is not organic. The problem is that there is a constant pressure to warp morality or definations so that treatments can be justified. That's an example of the "every body's doing it so why can't I ,,,,?" You folks argue that the use of formic acid is ok because it is naturally found in honey. Hair and garlic are not found in the honey I harvest. ;>) Smoke is not usually used as a treatment. Joe ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l for rules, FAQ and other info ---