I hope everyone had a nice Holiday last week, and I hope everyone has another nice Holiday this week. (I think every week should include one day dedicated to feasting, parties, good cheer, and gift-giving!) Allen had some good points, and while the title of his post is strictly accurate, I think that the "M" in "IPM" should have stood for "metrics". Without metrics (measurement, records, numbers) one cannot "manage" anything, and really can't even differentiate between: > In my case, I never had enough mites in > the fall to do serious damage. and: > Others may be overrun. One beekeeper's "overrun" may be another's "no big hairy deal". (Not to pick on poor Allen, as he has said that he does measure and keep records.) But I don't really care what the mite level is in the late fall when brood rearing has stopped. By then, the mites will have done their damage. What I care about is the DELTA in "natural" mite drop between weekly readings during June and July. If I start to see mites get out of hand, I have to treat, which, at present in the USA, means taking the colony out of production. Treatments coming soon to a bee supply dealer near you may allow beekeepers to modify this strategy. I hope. I think that it >>>IS<<< very nice to be able to treat with oxalic acid, and kill off mites in late fall. But all this means is that I can expect a slower and later ramp-up of varroa populations in the spring and early summer, or perhaps no varroa problem at all, given my relative isolation from other apiaries. That said, I can't use Oxalic Acid. It is not approved in the USA just yet. I sell my honey, so I have to stick with the approved methods. (That said, I did try powdered sugar for a season, as it was clearly a "food grade" item.) But fall treatments alone will not "save" a colony. Saving colonies means following a standard mite-drop tracking protocol starting in early June, which for me means a count of 48-hour "natural fall". I've said it before: One cannot control what they do not measure. jim (There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who read binary and those who don't.) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::