Bill Truesdell wrote: > My guess is that you could call it that now, no > matter what you do to > the bees since honey is natural. Honey is natural : true (as far it is not sugar honey at least). But for once, I'm afraid I have to disagree - a little - with you. Natural does not mean organic. "Whatever you do to bees" do not guaranty natural even if honey still comes from nectar. Otherwise, one could use the same statement for almost all crops. I guess a carrot is always carrot, always naturally grown from earth... and a salad as well. Except GMOs, one could say his crop is "natural"...whatever the pratices one use ? It may be legal right now, but it does not sound honest. > The problem is you can have as many definitions and > rules as you wish, > but it does not get around the problem that almost > all honey will pass > basic purity tests. OK, an non organic can be (and should be, otherwise it should not be sold) as safe as an organic product. But two things : 1. safety standards (as all standards) are moving limits, dependent on scientific knowledge, lobbying, analytical capacity (detection limit), analysis costs, monitoring parameters chosen... and so on. A "purity" test is then a necessary relative minimum safety standard... not a sufficient quality indicator. For example, according to some studies in Danmark I remember, sperm in organic products eaters was better (in quantity and in quality) than in non organic (but safe as well) products eaters. Sorry I do not remember the exact reference and I do not have the time to check it right now. 2. when I buy an organic product, I do not just buy an a priori free chemical product (since no analysis were performed to confirm this point), but I merely also buy a certain philosophy of living, a way to produce... in other terms I also want to influence the kind of society I want to live in. The end product can be the same, I do not care so much... as far as I am convinced the organic one is less polluting. > There are those in Maine who sell "Blueberry" honey. > There is such a > variety of color and taste that it is difficult to > believe blueberry > nectar varies so much from the same plant. So true for so many honeys. The worse is only honesty will preserve our long term market. If our labels are lying, why should customers buy our honey at higher prices instead of cheap imported honey ? Customers trust (or confidence, what is the right word ?) is an - almost - priceless graal, isn't it ? > how can you police > honey that is labeled, "natural", "organic", > "pesticide free" or even "I > use chemicals to kill bugs" when there is no > difference between any of > the honeys? To many confusing concepts, IMHO. But in the same way, it is another stong reason to ask for one "reasonable" certification, widely advertised and explained to customers, in order to rule the actual anarchic situation : all constraints (almost anachievable organic standards in most areas) or nothing (do what you want and label it "natural local honey"). > I also knew > that those who > labeled their honey "organic" cheated since they had > to treat for varroa > just like I did. ... which let me think : a bit less of stringent rules and a lot more of stringent controls would certainly be better for the "organic label" credibility . Hervé Le Rucher d'Émélys www.emelys.com Laval, Quebec, Canada ___________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::