Hello Jim & All,
Jim makes excellent points but I need to interject and perhaps explain the
word "threshold" as explained to me by several of the worlds most renown bee
researchers.

 I was skeptical at first till I saw "threshold " first hand with a yard of
dead bees.

 Dr. Delaplane at Savannah explained that the *figures* presented in the
post applied to an *average* strength hive in *fall* in Georgia with a
certain amount of leeway ( tests taken after most brood rearing had
stopped).

I have tried to pin Dr. Marion Ellis down several times ( Savannah, Keokuk
and K.C.)   on exact numbers for threshold but he points out the many
factors which can effect  "threshold" but he did agree Dr. Delaplane's
figures would be in a range he might suggest but Dr. Ellis prefers sugar
rolls done directly from a brood comb.

Definition of the word "threshold" as used by beekeepers & researchers doing
testing varies. Because the word is tossed around and misused by many
problems exist.

When I do testing and  I am standing at the hive with another beekeeper
reading the results from a roll or mite drop I read the number of varroa and
if in a certain range (determined by my past varroa testing over the years)
I simply say .

!. the hive needs treatment

2. the treatment needs not be done and  checked again in the fall or spring

3. The varroa load is what I consider to be over "threshold" and  no
treatment will save the colony.

Comment on number three:

When varroa first hit I found a yard  (which was one of my best yards for
honey production) had produced zero honey and all the brood nests had
dwindled down to about four frames of brood and bees. I did testing and
filled the sticky boards with varroa. I was told by our state inspector that
the hives  although queenright and  with several frames of brood were above
"threshold" (in his opinion based on the number of varroa on the sticky
board) and would die regardless of  use of a 98% chemical strip ( Apistan at
the time).

As usual I had to see for myself so I wasted money and put in strips.
 I showed my sticky boards to my close friend Cecil Sweeny at Mid-Con
Agrimarketing as I purchased the strips. Cecil  told me the same as our bee
inspector.

All of the hive died as both had said they would.


>   "Thresholds - the level of mites in a colony which requires
>   action by the beekeeper...."

I do not see the above as an inaccurate statement but add that there are at
least two "thresholds" or *points* in testing at which decisions need to be
made.

Jim said:
The fallacy of placing one's faith in a "threshold" is very basic.
There simply is no such animal.

Crude as varroa testing is the methods presented by our bee researchers is
all we have got at present time. Testing in my opinion beats the other
options which are.

1. treat all hives because your bee supply house says to.

2. treat all your hives because the beekeeper across town is treating all
his hives.

3. use a "snake oil" treatment which has no sound research done behind it
you read about on the internet without testing the method on only a few of
your hives first. THOUSANDS of hives were lost by beekeepers using unpoven
methods talked about in the halls of bee meetings in the early ninety's.
Allmost all were proven through research published in ABJ & Bee Culture to
have little if any varroa control.

 "Threshold"  exists for me but there are many "thresholds" to consider with
testing. The two MAIN  *points* or "thresholds" to consider in testing are.

1. the number figure you the beekeeper figure is the correct number for you
to  consider a mite treatment. In other words treat or leave untreated.

2. the number of varroa found in the sample which in your opinion would be
over "threshold" and treatment would not  correct the varroa infestation and
save the hive. Treatment would not only be a waste of money but those hives
unable to defend themselves would further spread varroa by being robbed out.

Please do not ask me to put an exact number for varroa found in a sample for
"Threshold" .As Jim pointed out the number might not be correct for your
area and hives.

I do agree  with Dr. Delaplanes figures posted that generally speaking
varroa counts on sticky boards in the range given would to me indicate
treatment is needed even in our area in late fall.   I applaud Dr. Delaplane
for giving the beekeepers trying to learn about testing for varroa figures
an idea of figures for when to treat. I personally consider the numbers
given in the ABJ article  high for my area and would consider treatment when
even half the low number of varroa (Delaplane ABJ article)  were found in
September but only my opinion.

I do still recommend the book "Mites Of The Honey Bee" by Thomas C. Webster
& and Keith S. Delaplane and published by Dadant.

 Many on the list have most likely seen the adds ran by Dadant with me
endorsing the book in the American Bee Journal. My name is used without
payment to me to help beekeepers to consider buying the book and learning
about both varroa & and tracheal mites. If you are only going to buy one
book on varroa the above book is the book to buy.
280 pages of useful mite information.

One chapter on mite biology. Eight chapters on tracheal mites. Eight
chapters on varroa and one chapter on other mite species.

In Savannah when I last spoke to Dr. Delaplane and he signed a copy of the
book for me Dr. Delaplane admitted during the two years the book was being
published new things about varroa were being learned so the book was
slightly outdated when published. I agreed but still the best mite book (in
my opinion) available today. Money well spent!
Sincerely,
Bob Harrison
Odessa, Missouri

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