Hello Stan & All,

Stan Sandler wrote:
 The  hay is  almost all double cut red clover.  There is lots of
discussion in the list  archives about red clover.  I clearly remember
one post by Andy Nachbaur  stating the his bees had made many crops of
honey on red clover.

Mine have in certain years usually after the first cutting and the
blossoms are stunted.  Clover needs a wet April and hot late spring and
summer to make a big honey crop off all clovers.  Red Clover is the
hardiest in hot weather.
Red Clover makes the most hay.   Red clover has a high tnn so is good to
feed in cold weather.  I roll red clover in big round bales for cold
weather feeding instead of the brome I am currently feeding.   Red
clover has quite a bit of stems like Alfalfa so there is waste.
Although a Beekeeper/farmer I prefer Red Clover for hay over the other
clovers.

 My own experience has been quite variable.  It is rare that I have
seen  the  bees working the first flowering.  I have sometimes made
crops on the second  flowering.  This year the bees seemed to ignore it
altogether.

White Dutch Clover normally makes a crop in our area every other year
but 2000 and 1999 were both poor years for White Dutch.  The bloom was
ok but they bees seemed uninterested in the blooms. We had a very try
early spring.

 I would put to the list the following questions:

 1.  Are there varieties of red clover known to be better honey
yielders?

 To my knowledge there isn't but there is with soybeans.
Temperature,humidity and soil conditions need to be right for bees to
work both clovers and Soybeans. I guess you could say for bees to work
most plants.

 2.  What might be some other possibilities for potato rotation?

Hairy Vetch BUT not crown vetch although beekeepers have reported crops
from crown in certain areas of the country.  We have been trying to get
the state road department to seed Hairy instead of crown but they say
the seed is cheaper for Crown.

  The   advantages of red clover to the farmers here is that the seed
is  cheap, the  clover is tall, palatable to cattle in silage, and
vigorous.

And makes better tonage of hay.  The only way you might get a farmer to
convert to a white clover is buy the seed yourself or pay the difference
in price.  20 acres of White Dutch will make about half the hay of 20
acres of red clover in our area.  The White Dutch crop could be improved
with Lime but then you have got another cost.
The Red clover seed is cheap in our area because it is drilled  in with
winter wheat and then combined for seed.  You get a double crop.
Pioneer and Monsanto have never found a way to keep farmers from saving
red clover seed . Yet!

  3.  Does anyone have information on rotating sweet clover with
potatoes?  There is one grower here who tried it one year, and was
sufficiently  impressed that he is going to try another field.

Yellow and white sweet clover in hay fields usually is a waste of time
for farmers (in our area).  Not near a vigorous as red clover.  I have
seeded quite a bit of Yellow & White sweet  clover along the roadways.
It seems to do better there until the road department cuts it down. They
have cost us big crops.  Twenty years ago they only cut the roadside
once maybe twice a year.   Now with all the *city folks* moving to the
country they keep the road departments phones ringing till my buddies
have to get out and mow.  They do leave my known bee locations to last.
My neighbor is head of the Lafayette county road dept..  City folks (now
wanabe country folks) complained this year about noxious weeds(honey
plants).  I had a whole bee yard die because the county sent their
workers wading through my fall honey crop flowers (weeds) with backpack
sprayers along the roadside near the yard.  When I bought land for my
bee farm all you could see was fields and open land. Now its $250,000
houses and people raising two kids,one horse and four or five BIG dogs.
The wife is even making me quit leaving the keys in the trucks and
equipment.  Guess they will be wanting me to move farther out before
long.  Hard to move when you started with a cow pasture and built the
place through your own sweat and hard work.
Sincerely,
Bob Harrison
Grumpy old beekeeper