Hello Ruth & All,

What is interesting in the controversy today is a new player has entered the
scene. Tom Seeley. Many call Seeley the new "Von Frish".
My friend Adrian Wenner sent me signed copy of his book "Anatomy of a
Controversy" for which I thank Adrian years ago. I now have a signed copy of
"The Wisdom of the Hive " by Tom Seeley. I have read both books.

Both these people make strong arguments for their positions.

I have to say Tom Seeley's power point presentation on "House Hunting by
Honey Bees" at the meeting last week was very impressive evidence for the
DL hypothesis.

DL is not a big concern of mine. Never has and never will be.

Ruth said:
(unless, like me, and many others, you don't believe in the existence of
"instincts" in the first place).

I do find the above curious as I live on a working farm and come from a
family of farmers. I observe "learned behavior"( from the mother & other
animals) and the behavior animals seem born with all the time.

Orphans display the most "instinct" ( or behavior not learned).

The dictionary defines "instinct" as:
" An innate tendency or response of a given species to act in ways that are
essential to its existence, development , and preservation.

I have taken animals orphaned by their mothers and given to other animals to
raise. Works for awhile until the natural tendency for the species develop
.
 Predatory animals can be loving babies but as they grow older the urge to
kill prey always develops.

I have let a mother chicken raise both a duck & and baby goose from eggs.
The duck could make a sound like a chicken. I still remember the mother
chicken trying to get the goose and duck to fly up on the roost in the
chicken house.

I remember the first time the mother chicken took her brood down by the pond
and went near crazy when the duck and goose hit the water.
I do not know if the word "instinct" is the correct word but somehow the
duck & goose knew the water would not bother them. The baby chickens would
not enter the water even after seeing the duck and goose babies swimming
around.

Bob

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