Hi Joel, Why are You criticising something You haven't tried?In My two short years of keeping bees I can tell the difference between a frame that is and is not propolizes to the hive body.I think You really should see one of these hives,the bees cannot reach the ends of the frames to propolize them, so it shouldn't matter if the hive is brand new or ten years old. Also You talk about "staggering" the supers or "jacking them up with sticks".Doesn't that tell You that something is lacking in the design of Your hive?(after all it was designed one hundred and thirty? years ago) The D.E.hive although not perfect is a vast improvement over the Langstroth hive.I really urge You to try one or at least go see one.I wouldn't expect a commercial beekeeper to switch over,but a hobbiest or new beekeeper really should do some research before buying an anciently designed hive.I only have eight hives(seven Langstroth),but I wish I never started with Langstroths,all future hives will be D.E.Hives,a modern hive. Garry Libby Boston,MA USA [log in to unmask]