After reading several simplistic rationalizations like... ... so if we don't like what is on them we can turn the knob all >the way to the left. WHEN CENSORSHIP THRIVES THE RIGHT TO FREE SPECH IS DEMINISHED ALONG WITH OTHER RIGHTS I HOLD DEAR!! ...I REALLY began to be offended. Of COURSE, the best response to the original bit of barnyard humor was to ignor it but the vigorous DEFENSE of material that was not only crude but outside the perameters of the list subject---makes that an abrogation of responsibility. The reason censorship happens is because of irresponsibility. Unfortunatly, the 'net will not be as free as it might have remained because of irresponsible purveyors of smut. No one particularly cares if perverts want to huddle in some private corner but those who delight in such things seem driven to foist them on others,(misery loves company, one supposes). No-one has a RIGHT to be offensive, however! One reads Bee-L expecting to see certain things there and the item in question was a word picture that had nothing to do with the list. Normally THAT alone would be sufficient to merit a warning but with the added dimension of sexual connotations the knee-jerk defense of titillating imagry by the more libertarian of our membership seems to have brushed all reason aside. The material was IRRELEVANT to the list AND offensive on top of it. That some folks on the list are intellectual lightweights in thrall to the rationalizations of the pornographers of the world is unfortunate but let them not speak for the general listmembership. On Suckling Jokes-L the material might've been appropriate---but I add my voice to those besieged folks who've dared to point out the obvious inappropriatness of such material on the Bee List. Bee-L is not meant for such material and posting it is an abrogation of the contract implied in the introduction to the list. Defending and encouraging it is worse though---THAT is destructive of the order and co-operation required on a list with such a large and varied membership. ...Stuart (Stuart Grant,(49degrees N; 123 degrees, 20 min W; elevation 20m; Strait of Georgia 2k; rural urban combination in temperate rainforest setting; 5 colonies ---3rd year) --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------