Tricia What a case! I really feel your frantic-ness coming through, and I think you're quite right on all points. I totally agree with you about a prohibition on nipple shields until Lactogenesis II has occurred - much much more productive as you say, to manually express colostrum for the first 2-3 days and feed on a spoon for a non-latching baby. With regard to the low-gain baby, you describe many absolutely classic signs - both in the baby's nursing behaviour and in the mother's response. You're quite right to be very concerned about this baby, and about the negative father... I think you responded very well. I'm going to send you by private mail a copy of my low-gain handout which describes how sleepy happy-to-starve babies behave (exactly as you describe). My experience is that a baby who is starting to get more becomes ravenous and wants more and more - and should have it - when catching up on low gain. The appetite will only begin to slow down when s/he has regained to normal weight for birthweight and age AND I find that babies cannot breastfeed effectively until that time too - I don't know why this is and maybe someone else has a physiological explanation - maybe lack of fat-pads in the cheeks or something - but even if the mother's milk supply is perfectly fine now, then the baby will fall down on weight gain unless he/she receives top-ups in another way until ALL the weight is packed on. Pamela Morrison IBCLC Rustington, England --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus *********************************************** Archives: http://community.lsoft.com/archives/LACTNET.html To reach list owners: [log in to unmask] Mail all list management commands to: [log in to unmask] COMMANDS: 1. To temporarily stop your subscription write in the body of an email: set lactnet nomail 2. To start it again: set lactnet mail 3. To unsubscribe: unsubscribe lactnet 4. To get a comprehensive list of rules and directions: get lactnet welcome