Hello Deknow & All, The experiment ran by the USDA-ARS is important to most because of the size of the experiment (400 hives) and the complete experiment has been over seen by Jeff Pettis (head of Beltsville Bee Lab). Around the world many beekeepers are watching with interest. The information I received by phone from Australia last night was from an Australian commercial beekeeper which spoke at great length with Denis Anderson about his week researching, speaking with Hackenberg and the USDA- ARS team. For those on the list which may not know who Denis Anderson is ( hard to believe) I will say Denis has shocked beekeeping researchers around the beekeeping world with his discoveries about varroa and bees. Denis gave us the term varroa destructor. We in the U.S. are very lucky to get a researcher of Denis Anderson's caliber to take a look and give his opinion! Many of us are looking into the current problems but testing is not complete. Our recent testing of taking a hive going backwards and putting on new comb did not change the scenario ( as using radiation on the Hackenberg eguipment has done). So now some CCD effected beekeepers are doing queen replacement to see if the queen is effected in some way and a queen change will change the scenario. work in progress. >" shipping bees which are not strong and healthy" I think Deknow misses the point but only because he does not perhaps understand the way hives are moved in fall into Texas & California. There are two methods. 1. All hives which are queenright and seem healthy are moved.This method has an element of luck needed. 2. Only the strongest and the rest are depopulated. Works most of the time but failed last fall with the loads of bees of Lance Sundberg which really got my attention. Hives gone though ( Montana) and full of bees and two weeks later ( California) only a few bees and a box full of brood and larva, Since the "gold rush" to almonds many commercial beekeepers have moved to using number 1 ( risky but with record almond pollination prices some feel worth the risk). Then trying to rebuild or combine in California. Hives are being trucked which would not have been a decade ago. Renting into almonds is the big reason in my opinion. As example Richard Adee used to only keep 25% of his hives (BC article from 90's) and depopulate the rest as he needed the equipment to use again. Many of his hives were depopulated by Bell Honey in Florida and then the empty equipment sent to the operation in Mississippi( I was involved in this part). In those days after the honey flow in the Dakota's was over and *if* fifty percent were dead it was not cause for concern and only meant the deadouts were sent to Mississippi instead of Florida to be depopulated. Actually saved on trucking and cost in Florida of depopulation. The beekeeper in Florida at the time employed a much larger work force than the Adee operation ( has actually been larger at various times in beekeeping history) and was set up for depopulating the hives in a huge building setting. Said beekeeper is retired now ( rumors say silent partner in certain beekeeping operations ) and the plan does not really fit now since the Adee's are big into almond pollination and as I understand go now directly to California from the Dakota's in fall. The point I make is one my long time friend Jerry B. has trouble with. 50% losses seem ok with some beekeepers he seems not to understand. Unlike the hobby beekeeper (same actually give queens names) the commercial beekeeper decides on the number of hives he will run. As example say a 1000 hives and he requeens every year. So if he wants to requeen all he takes one strong hive and turn into four in spring he needs to depopulate 75% (750 hives using the above example) to have the equipment he needs in spring. He keeps the absolute best 250 and sends to the splitting area which in the case of the Adee's was Mississippi and for us is Texas. The commercial migratory beekeeper now has his 1000 hives back with new queens. A young queen pays instead of costs! Understanding the methods of the large beekeeping outfits is hard to understand unless you have been directly involved such as i have for many years. Not always do I have the time for a long explanation but understanding the methods migratory beekeepers use I think helps in understanding the problems they face. Beekeeping was so easy in the fifties and sixties! Complicated today! Still trying to retire after nine years! bob ****************************************************** * Full guidelines for BEE-L posting are at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/guidelines.htm * ******************************************************