To each his own, but I think that we lack both hard facts and plausible explanations of mechanisms that I would "buy" to support any of the following claims: a) That airflow in a hive is a "convective loop" when there are bees in the hive, and the hive is subjected to environmental forces (wind, temperature fluctuations, etc). b) That follower boards creating a slightly wider space between the hive body and the first interior surface than a comb would, and on only two sides of the hive, are enough to eliminate problematic "roof condensation" in a hive under a wide range of conditions. c) I might be more inclined to believe (b) this effect were enhanced (or only detectable) if one SIDE of the hive was facing south, and hence the larger space was exposed to the warming of the sun, but no one has claimed this, and most folks are not going to want entrances that face east or west, especially in winter. (Don't flame me pallet users, you have allowed "packaging" to override optimal conditions for the bees in my view. It is a fair tradeoff, it just ain't "optimal".) As luck would have it, we are blessed with the presence of Jerry Bromenshenk, who seems to have as many wires in some of his hives as bees. :) We are also blessed with Lloyd, who is smart enough to see the implications of all this for his Ross Round supers, and is wondering if he REALLY should be telling people to use 7 plastic assemblies per super, rather than 8, and likely has sketched a new "adapter kit" with bigger spaces at the sides of the super to test against his current "8-frame" approach. Jerry has a buddy (Robert Madsen) who is running a study that appears to support the "convective loop" contention. Problem is, my PhD is in physics (rather than beekeeping), and I don't "buy" extrapolation of small-scale airflow within a limited space based upon nothing more than temperature measurements with thermocouples. [I call George Imrie as a cooborating expert witness on this point, but only if he promises to stop leaning on the caps lock key! :) ] So, let's help Madsen out, and suggest an improved methodology for his study that will allow him to have much more "bullet-proof" data, by doing a cursory cross-check of his existing data set with data from sensors that really measure both humidity and airflow. (If Madsen is not interested, Lloyd may want to fund Jerry to do this work...) MOISTURE This one is easy. The lab's "quartermaster list" database includes one of these, as someone apparently ordered one for some reason, and it now sits on a shelf in the stockroom: 10-90% Humidity Sensor BC1333-ND $11.94 www.digikey.com Hey, that sounds like just the ticket! A cheap, small sensor that can detect "humidity"! Never used one before, but there it is, waiting to be played with. Perhaps Robert Madsen can be convinced to add some of these to his hive instrumentation. (There are likely lots of other similar sensors out there.) AIRFLOW I also said I don't like "airflow" data that was extrapolated from mere temperature readings from thermocouples. Why? Because it is so easy to directly read airflow, all cars made in the past decade or so have "mass airflow sensors". The better/newer ones are 100% solid state. I don't have a specific off-the-shelf low-cost sensor to suggest here, but there are several lab-grade sensors, and I'd bet that one could find a mass-produced automotive sensor that was both cheap and sensitive enough to read the very slow, gentle airflow claimed to exist in beehives. To explain how it works, in a "hot-wire sensor", air flows around a wire heated by a tiny electric current. The wire is kept at a constant temperature by the current, as the temperature of the wire determines the resistance of the wire, and thereby, the current. (In other words, the wire is a "lousy" resistor for any other practical electronic application except this one, as it has a serious problem with "temperature drift" that is being exploited.) As one gets increased air mass flow (more volume, or colder denser, air) past the sensor, convection heat transfer from the wire to the air is increased, and more current is required to regulate the temperature. The current requirement thus acts as an index. It is converted to a voltage signal which is then used. In general, the power (volts * amps) required to keep the "hot wire" at the same temperature is proportional to the square root of the airspeed (King's law). So, there ya go... any takers? jim (Who thinks that there is a fine line between optimism and self-delusion about simple models of anything that goes on in a beehive.) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::