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BEE-L  June 1999, Week 5

BEE-L June 1999, Week 5

Subject:

Re: Connie's learning curve...

From:

"David D. Scribner" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

David D. Scribner

Date:

Wed, 30 Jun 1999 12:33:08 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (214 lines)

Hi Connie!  I can't help you with your mentoring, but I'll try to answer a
few of your questions...

> upon inspection of the hive body we discovered in the lower deep body
> the comb seemed to be melted and misshapen and empty. The bees were
> occupying the short above. I removed the deep body and put another short
on
> top of the occupied one under the excluder.  There was not drawn comb
> above the excluder.

A few things here.  It sounds as if you're leaving your excluders on all
year long (spring, summer, fall and through the winter).  If this is the
case, don't.  Bees don't really like excluders, and are hesitant in going
through them to the supers above unless they have to (i.e.: during a good
nectar flow).  Usually, I add my excluders in the spring when I add the
supers that will be filled for harvest.  In the fall, when the last harvest
has been taken, I remove them.  Leaving them on during the winter is risky.
If there is honey above the excluder, the bees won't break cluster and move
up to it through the excluder if it means leaving the queen behind.  They'll
starve themselves out instead.

> At the time I did not have the parts to make up another deep body. The
bees
> were quickly filling both short boxes and I managed to swap a frame of
honey
> and place it above the excluder before the new hive parts arrived for
> assembly. By the time I received my deep bodies they had completely filled
> both short boxes and had started to draw comb in one frame above the
> excluder. I wasn't sure what to do at this point so I put a newly
assembled
> deep box with a feeder in between the two shorts that had been the main
hive
> body in an uneducated attempt to give the bees more room. I have not done
> anything to hive except open the top to look in. It seems to be full of
very
> happy bees. There is still no activity above the excluder but I don't
expect
> it with all the new room they received.

Actually, IMHO, I would have added the deep above the two shallows, but
under the excluder.  It's bee's natural inclination to move upward.  That is
why they left the bottom and moved into the shallow.  I'm surprised they
didn't eventually move downward again on their own, but a practice many
beekeepers (including myself) use is called "reversing".

In spring, you'll often find the cluster in the upper brood chamber, with
the bottom chamber empty.  Switch positions of the brood chambers, putting
the empty on top of the one in use.  Some advise to leave this "technique"
only to the experts.  I've never really understood why, as I've done this
since I began keeping bees and have never had any problems.  What you DO
need to have is common sense.  Reversing brood chambers, if done when the
bees are occupying the mid-area where the supers meat (the top of the
bottom, and the bottom of the top), can cause them to split their brood into
two areas.  If the weather is too cool, or if there aren't enough bees to do
the job, this can cause the bees to get stressed as they try to take care of
the entire brood, but spread over a great distance.  If you're using two
deeps for a brood chamber, inspect the hive and when you find the top full
and the bottom more or less empty (as in your case), THEN do the switch.
This also helps to relieve some congestion, and may help to curb swarming in
the spring.

> My question is, how do I manipulate
> this hive so I can remove the short body from the bottom and get it
situated
> with two deeps instead?

Others may suggest finding the queen and moving her into the deep, putting
the excluder on top of this, moving frames, etc., etc.  Make it easy on
yourself.  I've been where you are now, and would suggest that you move the
shallow super that is currently on the top, to below the deep.  This was the
super I would expect from your message that the queen is currently using to
lay eggs in.  By putting it under the deep, you will give them room to move
up.

Since we're already into the first of July, give them time to move up into
the deep.  Once they have made the migration, and you find the bottom
shallow completely empty of brood, set it aside for the moment.  Inspect the
next shallow.  It probably won't be completely empty, so put it back under
the deep brood chamber.  Now you've got one shallow, and a deep, that are
being used for brood rearing.

Closer to where you want it, but not there yet.  If you can forego
harvesting any honey from this hive this year, when you're through you
should have a strong hive that will winter great, and be "ready and raring"
to go next spring.

Next, take the deep with foundation installed that you built, and put it on
top of the deep that is currently being used for brood.  Follow this with
the queen excluder.  On top of the excluder, you can place the shallow super
you set aside if it (more than likely) still has a little honey and pollen
in it.  The bees should eventually start to draw out the foundation in this
deep, and start using it for food storage.  They'll bring the honey from the
very top shallow down, and use up the pollen, unless they need the storage
room.  If they do need the storage, they'll store honey in it.

Since I don't know the flow times in your area, and don't know if you're in
the mountains around Fayetteville or not (where it gets colder, sooner), I
would expect (but can't say for certain... but then who can with bees), that
they may have filled up this top deep by fall (late August) with honey.
Once this has been done, you will probably have already noticed the very
bottom shallow was empty and could be removed.  You now have your brood
chambers consisting of two deeps, and your bees should be ready to go
through the winter with plenty of stores and ready for you to do your
reversal next spring.  If you're not harvesting honey from this hive this
year, I would highly suggest feeding them a sugar syrup.  If a strong honey
flow is on, they may not take the syrup, but if one is not, or the flow is
weak, the syrup will help them along in giving them what they need to draw
out all these frames and build a good store of food for the winter.

> Upon inspection they were drawing comb and tending
> brood well. I added a second deep body to encourage their growth when they
> had nearly filled the first box.When they had that one almost full I added
a
> short super to the top. My question is, should I have added an excluder?

Yes, if you plan on harvesting honey from this hive this year.  Excluders,
as mentioned above, help prevent the queen from moving up and laying brood
in the supers you plan on harvesting.  Some beekeepers don't use them, and
some will argue that they decrease the amount of harvestable honey as the
bees hesitate to go through them.  There may be times when the bees have
sufficient honey stores above the brood that a natural "honey barrier" will
prevent the queen from moving upward into honey supers, but IMHO, I use them
and feel it's easier (especially for a "bee-ginner") to use them and not
even worry if there's enough barrier to prevent brood from being laid in the
honey supers or not.

> I was wearing only summer attire. Next time I'll at least wear a hat .
This
> is the second bee I've had in my hair and it is a chilling experience.
Maybe
> they don't like my shampoo.

At least buy yourself a veil to go with that hat, Connie.  Your bees may be
very docile, until that eventual "one afternoon".  You'll be glad you had
one on that day.

> Does anyone know the dates of honey flow  for my
> North West Arkansas area?

I don't know the dates, but this site has information on nectar sources,
with bloom dates, for much of Missouri... http://beekeeper.missouri.org/ .
Since you're location would share many of the sources for southern Missouri,
you might gather a lot of useful information there.

> What are the nine slot frame hangers used for?

Once your bees have drawn out the foundation in ten frames in your honey
supers, many beekeepers, after removing the supers for harvest, take out the
tenth and just use nine frames from then on.  When the bees fill out the
frames the next time around, since they are spaced just a little farther
apart (but not to far to ruin the bee space), they will draw them out wider.
This gives you just as much honey in those nine frames as they would store
in ten, in the same super.  Extracting is also easier as you don't have as
many frames to uncap and extract.  Uncapping is also easier, if you're using
a knife, as sunken depressions usually won't go below the endbars (when you
have to put down the knife and grab the cappings scratcher). I love using
nine frames, and relish the heft and feel of one of those thick babies!

The slotted frame hangers are a hassle to use unless you have enough supers
around that don't have them mounted in them (i.e.: commercial beekeepers).
They are mounted more or less permanently in the hive, and if you need the
hive for frames of foundation, you'll either have to take them back out, or
wind up with a mess.  Since your a hobbyist, spend that money instead on a
frame spacer tool.  It's a device that DOESN'T mount on the rabbit of the
super.  Instead, once you have your frames in the super, the tool (handheld,
and looks like it has huge triangular teeth on it), is used at both ends of
the frames to space them correctly.  Just slide the big teeth between the
frames until it stops, and your set!  Until you get to know and judge the
distance correctly, this tool is handy and quick.

You don't want to use just nine frames with sheets of foundation, as since
the foundation is not drawn yet, the space between frames will be too great.
The bees will fill up that space with burr and brace comb.  You'll wind up
with twisted and welded comb that makes pulling the frames almost
impossible.  Let the bees draw the comb in ten frames, then once it's been
drawn, just put nine of those frames back in.  Some beekeepers use just
eight of these thick frames in their honey supers!  Personally, I just use
nine... seems to be the right number for me, but it's strictly personal.

> Should I have excluders on all my hives?

Only those that you plan to harvest honey from in the current year.
Remember, on in the spring, and off in the fall with those excluders.

> How often should I do a thorough inspection on the hive bodies?

Others will have their own opinions, though I personally will try to inspect
the brood three to four times during the spring-to-fall season... more if I
suspect problems of course.  The first spring inspection is to see how your
queen and her troop have fared, what needs to be done, judge about how soon
to reverse, check food stores, etc.  Again a few weeks later, as the first
spring flow is starting, I'll check into the brood chambers again to inspect
the brood for pattern, disease, etc.  I don't try to find the queen unless I
have to (requeening, for example), I can tell a lot about the queen's
condition by the condition of the brood, and the bees coming and going from
the hive.  I'll sometimes check it again, later in the season, especially if
I notice things aren't "right".  I also check the brood in the fall before
going into winter to get a feel for how the hive will winter-over.  I try to
do this check early enough that if I need to requeen, I have time to acquire
a queen from a breeder or let the bees raise a new queen before going into
the winter.  A new queen in fall does best if she's had the time to raise a
bit of brood.  This is especially important if you let the bees raise their
own queen, as she'll need to replace a lot of brood that was lost during the
time she was being raised.  As well, you'll want to have her emerged and
taking her mating flights while there are still plenty of drones around!

I hope this has answered at least some of your questions.  I'm sure they'll
be more, but it sounds like you're on a good start for a great harvest next
year!

Best of luck,
--David Scribner <[log in to unmask]>
  Niche on the Net! - <http://www.bigfoot.com/~dscribner>

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