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BEE-L  August 2014

BEE-L August 2014

Subject:

Re: Locally adapted?

From:

charles Linder <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sat, 30 Aug 2014 20:30:44 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (48 lines)

Darwin pointed out the immediate adaptation of many species to
changes in their environment.  For example, animals moved to colder
climates grow longer hair than they normally would.  That observation alone
puts the lie to the argument.

True to a small point,  they may grow longer hair as allowed by genetics,
but an elephant transplanted to Norway does not become a mammoth,  it dies.

I pondered the "adapted term" a bit.   I still disagree strongly with the
concept are bees are adapting to any climate issues.  Certain genetic traits
make one specicies better suited than another.  And thus those genes are
carried on.  Your argument is that then they are adapted.  I can see that to
a point.  But they did not truly adapt in any time frame we could define.
Whats happened is natural selection has eliminated those without the traits.

One comment by Kevin is about the brood rearing.   It's a very interesting
observation.  But it seems to me were still talking about genetic traits.
Such as Russian and Italian differences.   If you take Italian bees north,
they don't do well in winter because of large clusters  and needing huge
stores. (yes it can be argued but just in general)  within a few generations
many will die off and those who's traits best matched that need will have
successfully bred.  But they did not adapt.  No bee or genome in the bee
decided to make a smaller cluster.  The queen didn't look out the window and
see her shadow and decide its time to brood up.  What happened was the
queens who genetically were prone to those traits survived.
Early brood buildup is great,  it's a trait we breed for.  But that's it,
we breed for it.  You won't see a queen change her habits,  that would be
adapting.

You can make the observation that over time they "adapted" to me it's a
stretch of the word.  What's happening now is a lot of people are using the
term way out of context.  I go back to my original question? What are
locally adapted bees?  How do you define or show it??  Way too many are
using this term like it means something in a sales brochure.  Obviously as
you point out,  over time the gentics become different.  Such as we see now.
But that's not happening in our lifetimes.    

I fully understand the term survivor stock,  and how some are defining it.
but that's in the context of TF....  how and why do we let the term Locally
adapted into our vocabulary when we cannot define it or show it??

Charles

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