--- On Sat, 6 Jan 1996 20:35:15 -0500 Automatic digest processor
<[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>There are 13 messages totalling 300 lines in this issue.
>
>Topics in this special issue:
>
> 1. Drug--anti depressants
> 2. Lactnet is a place for * professional* connection...
> 3. GLOPAR
> 4. ulcers
> 5. discharge protocols
> 6. homeopathics for colds/flus.
> 7. breast milk for adults
> 8. Sex and breasts
> 9. newborn output
> 10. Donna Zitzelberger BSN, CLE posted a proposed hospital
> 11. Marie's bad day
> 12. <No subject given>
> 13. Sub-mucosal cleft
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 16:04:55 -0500
>From: "Deana R. Hannah" <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: Drug--anti depressants
>
>Hey Lacnetters,
> I wonder if anyone out there has any experience with a mother taking
>Zoloft 50 mg. in the a.m. followed by 2mg. Navane in the p.m. Baby is 2 wks
>old. Mom took medication through out the pregnancy. Baby is mostly bottlefed
>at this time . Mom is undecided about breastfeeding and is getting mixed
>reccomedations from doctors. Thanks for any info you can provide. Deana
>Hannah for LC who is trying to get online.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 17:21:54 -0500
>From: Kathleen Bruce <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: Lactnet is a place for * professional* connection...
>
>Please remember that Lactnet is for professional connection and discussion.
>I regret to say that at this time, we are unable to field questions of a
>personal nature from the general public. I would like to refer those who
>would like to discuss/find mother to mother bf support and connection to
>their local LLL group, to their local Lactation consultant, or to the online
>group Parent L, a listserv similar to this, but for mothers and those
>interested in extended breastfeeding and attachement.
>
>Narelle, Can you please give us a blurb about parent l, where to find it ,
>etc? I think it is wonderful.
>
>Kathleen
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
>Kathleen B. Bruce, BSN, IBCLC, LLL Leader
>Co-Owner Lactnet, LLLOL, Corgi-L E-mail lists
>LACTNET WWW site: http://www.mcs.com/~auerbach/lactation.html
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 17:31:05 EST
>From: CATHY LILES <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: GLOPAR
>
>Howdy,
>I will be travelling to Orlando on Monday to attend the US GLOPAR
>training as an LLL representative. GLOPAR is a WABA project. This
>will be the first US training and we are expecting a great turnout. I
>will also be attending the conference there for one day. Will anyone
>else be attending and would you like to get together? and are there
>any questions or concerns that we can address for you while there?
>If so, please e-mail me directly before Monday . [log in to unmask]
>Cathy Liles
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 18:18:30 -0500
>From: "Mardrey Swenson, LLL Leader" <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: ulcers
>
>Hi
>
>I don't remember how we got on the subject but yes, most recurring gastric
>ulcers are thought to be due to Camphylobacter pylorii. Duodenal ulcers have
>not been shown to be caused by this wee beastie.
>
>Mardrey
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 18:24:58 -0500
>From: Elizabeth Puzar <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: discharge protocols
>
>Donna,
>
>These are my general guidelines for healthy full-term, fully breastfed
>(without any supplementing with water or formula) infants:
>
>First 24 hours: one wet diaper and one tarry stool
>
>Second 24 hours: two wet diapers and two blackish stools
>
>Third 24 hours: three wet diapers and two greenish stools
>
>Fourth 24 hours: four wet diapers and three stools--hopefully yellow by now
>
>Fifth 24 hours: five wet diapers and three yellow stools
>
>Sixth 24 hours: six wet diapers and three to four yellow stools
>
>These are the minimums. If the minimums aren't met, I look for the reason:
>Is the baby jaudiced and/or sleepy?
>Are the mother's nipples sore?
>How frequently is the baby breastfeeding? "On demand" is not a satisfactory
>answer as some babies are truly content to starve.
>Are the feedings limited to a certain number of minutes?
>Has the "milk come in"?
>Were any drugs or interventions used during labor and delivery?
>Did the mother experience any breast changes during pregnancy?
>Was the baby born at <37 weeks?
>Does the baby weigh less than six pounds?
>Has the mother had any breast surgeries?
>Is the mother or baby taking any medications?
>
>I could go on and on with possible questions. IMHO, if a the output isn't as
>expected, the LC should become involved. I disagree strongly with the advice
>to breastfeed and follow with formula. Giving a bottle of formula doesn't
>solve the problem. If the output is low, the intake is probably also low,
>and that's what needs to be fixed. Adequate milk transfer, for some reason,
>is not taking place.
>
>I believe telling a mother to give a bottle of formula undermines her goal of
>breastfeeding this baby. The baby will not want to breastfeed as soon and
>consequently the breasts will not get the stimulation that the next feeding
>would provide. It tells the mother than something is wrong--either with her
>breasts or with her baby. It promotes bottlefeeding, which could cause a
>whole other constellation of problems. It promotes the use of formula, which
>is inferior to breastmilk. It can provide the sensitizing dose of cow's milk
>protein and contribute to the risk of allergies in the future.
>
>The LC should be called if the baby is not having enough wet and soiled
>diapers. He/she can evaluate the mother/baby pair and make the appropriate
>recommendations. It may be as simple as a change in positioning or latch-on
>technique, increasing the number of feeds or increasing the stimulation to
>the breasts. A bottle of formula wouldn't address any of these issues.
>
>Elizabeth Puzar, IBCLC
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 12:25:50 +1200
>From: Judy Grundy <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: Re: homeopathics for colds/flus.
>
>I have sucessfully used homeopathics to treat colds in myself and my baby
>for colds and flus. I have used echinacea and a product called 'infludo'
>by weleda.
>
>'Infludo' contains a mixture of homeopathics - if anyone is interested I
>wouldn't mind looking up what the components are. Blackmores also puts out
>some brilliant tablets for colds and flus which work very well.
>
>Probably, the best remedy I have found is called 'Immune' by red seal.
>This always seems to knock colds and flus on the head overnight and most
>other things within a dy or two.
>
>Love, Judy.
>--
>Judy Grundy
>email: [log in to unmask]
>WWW: http://www.cs.waikato.ac.nz/~jgrundy/judy.html
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 12:34:02 +1200
>From: Judy Grundy <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: breast milk for adults
>
> Hi all,
>
>In my knowledge there is no problem if adults consume breastmilk. I have
>even heard of some cultures giving breatmilk to the sick, and particularly
>the elderly, and apparently it can be a miracle cure!
>
>CeCe, does your boyfriend drink cow's milk? Surely this is more unnatural
>than to consume human milk. he is not a calf after all!
>
>Isn't it strange that society doesn't bat an eyelid when cow's milk is
>drunk yet considers it somewhat awful to think of drinking human milk which
>is after all meant for humans.
>
>The cholesterol in breastmilk is not a problem as breastmilk also contains
>other properties that help brek down the cholesterol. Also, two types of
>cholesterol exist. One is not so good but the other is essential in the
>human body. If enough of this essential cholesterol is not consumed the
>body will actually manufacture it itself so either way, we are going to get
>this cholesterol in our bodies.
>
>hope this helps.
>
>Judy.
>
>--
>Judy Grundy
>email: [log in to unmask]
>WWW: http://www.cs.waikato.ac.nz/~jgrundy/judy.html
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 19:02:08 EST
>From: Norma Ritter <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: Re: Sex and breasts
>
> Whether or not female breasts are "supposed" to be sexually attractive to males and/or sources of sexual pleasure for women is a fascinating subject. Given that their primary biological purpose is that of producing milk, it seems to me that bodily functions which ensure the continuation o
f the species would *need* to be pleasurable as an incentive! For example, we eat a variety of foods in pleasant surroundings for fun as well as for adequate nutrition. Why shouldn't breasts be a source of sexual delight to the mother (and the father!) as well as a source of food (and pleasure!) f
or the baby? I have always understood that the largest sexual organ is, in fact, the skin. While certain cultures and individuals may choose to designate particular parts of the body as inherently sexual, the choice is very wide.
> On a personal note, although I have long recognised that in our culture breasts are considered to be secondary sexual characteristics, I only started to receive any sexual pleasure from mine since the birth of my first child. I wonder how unusual (or *normal*) this might be?
>
>
>Norma Ritter, IBCLC, LLLL "If not now, when? If not us, who?"
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 20:18:43 -0500
>From: Linda Stewart <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: newborn output
>
>To respond to Denise Hewson's query re output during the first few days. The
>criteria at my hospital is one or more urines per day for the first 5 days,
>then more that that. BM's need to have completely changed by that magic 5
>days, from the typical meconium to typical breast milk stools. We tell
>parents that it needs to be a lot of volume or a lot of frequency, or both.
> Less indicates lack of intake, hence a problem and they are instructed to
>call their ped provider. I hope that this info helps.
>
>[log in to unmask]
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 20:23:51 -0500
>From: Margery Wilson <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: Donna Zitzelberger BSN, CLE posted a proposed hospital
>
> protocol for assessing babies in
>
>Donna Zitzelberger BSN, CLE posted a proposed hospital protocol for assessing babies in
>hospital:
>>First 24 hours of Life: one urine and one stool (tarry black)
>>Second 24 hours of Life: 3 urine and 3 stools (tarry black or green)
>>Third 24 hours of Life: 3 urine and 3 stools (green)
>>Fourth 24 hours of Life and after: 6-8 urines and 3 stools (may have up to 6-10) , stools
>changing to green/yellow
>
>I am interested in hearing input from the gastroenterologists and other specialists who can
>better address this subject. My first reaction to the above protocol is apprehension. Do we need
>to qualify and quantify this much?
>
>Since I am not hospital based perhaps I do not have the same urgency for documentation. I see
>infants after they are discharged. Stooling is my "gold standard" :-D for determining how feeds
>are going so I always ask parents to keep track. Many of the infants I follow have no stools
>between days 2 and 5. An in-person evaluation is called for but, as long as the baby looks
>healthy otherwise, is nursing appropriately, has passed stool at some point since birth, and is
>making wet diapers I tend to "wait and see." Day 5 seems a popular day for "action" by the
>baby. In fact, IMO, Day 5 seems to be a day of action, in general, for babies. Perhaps it takes
>this long for some babies to realize they are born? <g>
>
>Starting babies on formula because (1) "milk is not in" or (2) because stooling is not going by
>protocol seems ludicrous and counterproductive. Colostrum is milk, and its "in." Formula feeds
>only get in the way of assessment and breastfeeding. How is "dehydration" or "low sugar" being
>diagnosed? IMO most of the time it is very unscientific assessment that leads to the opinion
>that baby is dry or hypoglycemic.
>
>Of course I see the need to use stooling as an assessment; however, I worry that babies will be
>subjected to inappropriate interventions based on unrealistic expectations. The older I get the
>more concerned I become of having assessment "tools" transformed into dogma and protocols.
>This seems to me to be leading further down the path of medicalization of breastfeeding.
>
>Well, now I have found one of my hot buttons!
>
>Stepping down and watching, with interest, for discussion.
>
>Margery Wilson, IBCLC
>Massachusetts Institute of Technology Medical Department
>ILCA Region I (New England states) Representative
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 20:28:08 EST
>From: LINDA C DRAPER <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: Marie's bad day
>
>Marie: You have my sympathy for the experience with the C-section mom.
> Even with all the good things we are able to accomplish each day
>that ofne negative incident certainly undermines us. Hang in there!
>Linda
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 20:30:05 -0500
>From: Margery Wilson <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: <No subject given>
>
>Subject lines ignored by software...Sorry about the way my
>system has been fouling up the subject lines. For some
>reason the first line of text has been over-riding the subject
>line, making for annoying archiving...I'm working on it!
>Aaarrrggghhh :-(
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 20:32:33 EST
>From: LINDA C DRAPER <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: Sub-mucosal cleft
>
>I have been a pediatric nurse practitioner for 20+ years. A long time
>ago a special mentor explained that a proper exam for cleft palate
>included a digital check because you can't see this type of cleft but
>you can feel it. Feels likes an opening in the hard palate but
>covered. Something to remember when we do our digital exams for suck
>evaluation.
>
>------------------------------
>
>End of LACTNET Digest - 6 Jan 1996 - Special issue
>**************************************************
>
-----------------End of Original Message-----------------
-------------------------------------
Name: Toby Gish R.N.LLLL.IBCLC
E-mail: Toby Gish <[log in to unmask]>
Date: 21/03/96
Time: 06:09:38 PM
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