BEE-L Archives

Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology

BEE-L@COMMUNITY.LSOFT.COM

Options: Use Monospaced Font
Show Text Part by Default
Show All Mail Headers

Message: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Topic: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Author: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]

Print Reply
Subject:
From:
Reply To:
Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Wed, 14 Apr 2010 13:40:39 EDT
Content-Type:
text/plain
Parts/Attachments:
text/plain (88 lines)
Bob hints that I have an alternative hypothesis as to a marker or cause of  
CCD, and that's true.  We've several lines of evidence pointing to N.  
cernae acting with another pathogen, which has proven difficult to  fully 
identify.  We're not trying to hold back anything, but we are trying  to get our 
hypothesis with ALL of the supporting lines of evidence  published.
 
We've assembled a large team of mostly volunteer scientists, since  the 
Wide Area study money went to the USDA labs, and the other big funding  
package, CAPS went to the ag schools.  We're working on small amounts  of funding, 
and lots of 'free' help.  So, we're slow. 
 
We've been trying to get this published since December.  We  just submitted 
it to another journal this morning, and I sincerely hope  this journal 
accepts it.  Its been extensively rewritten, edited with  a fine tooth comb, and 
new lines of evidence added.
 
As you all remember, Science published the initial paper that concluded  
that IAPV was a marker  of CCD and implied it might be  a cause of CCD, 
pointing to Australia as the source of the  IAPV.  That paper reached a very broad 
audience, and had a big impact on  the public, researchers, and especially 
funding agencies.  We'd like  to reach the same audience with our 
alternative hypothesis.
 
However, Science proved to be a hard sell - first saying that CCD was not  
of general interest (I guess its old news), then offering other excuses.   
After each, we addressed the issues, re-submitted.  
 
We did get them to review the full manuscript in February.  The  reviewers 
were mostly positive about our work - but we got a mix  of rankings, from 
'publish' by a world expert in bee diseases (I heard  from the reviewer after 
the rejection by Science), to this work is interesting,  but its flawed, 
because 'proteomics can't ID pathogens to strain level'  (when in fact our 
colleagues have not only shown that this can be done by  proteomics, and they 
had their paper on this very topic published by  Nature), and finally, we had 
the reviewer who apparently read only the  abstracts from miscellaneous IAPV 
papers, because he/she misquoted all of  them.  
 
He/she concluded that we had to be wrong, because IAPV has been  shown to 
be the marker/cause of CCD, and then cites another paper  as evidence that 
iRNA cures CCD, and finally claims that transcriptome  research points to DWV 
and BCV as contributing to CCD.  
 
With each review, we seem to have the 'good' fortune of drawing one or more 
 reviewers who are still committed to IAPV as a cause of CCD.  
Unfortunately  for us, our data shows that IAPV, although common on the east coast, and  
scattered on the west coast, is NOT correlated with CCD.  
 
That statement makes the IAPV camp see red.  As such, we  get mixed 
reviews.  Major journals look for reasons to reject  manuscripts, so any negative 
reviews and you're likely to be rejected.  So,  here's hoping we get 
accepted, so that everyone can see what we have found - its  complicated.  I'd 
rather everyone has the full document - which stands at  46 pages.  As we've seen 
from this list, partial summaries tend to lead to  misinterpretation.  I 
look forward to being able to openly discuss  and debate our findings, but 
only after everyone can see all  that we've found.
 
Do we have the definitive answer - no.  But, I think we've  made progress, 
and I think its important.  However, until we get  published, I will simply 
say that we think N. ceranae is part of  the problem.  Nosema by itself, you 
may be ok, but combine it with other  pathogens and you've a different 
scenario.  And we think there is one in  particular that is closely associated 
with Nosema.  Get the two, and you  will likely experience CCD.  At the 
moment, there is no cure for the  'other pathogen', but there are things you can 
do about Nosema - maybe not the  best tools around, but you can monitor 
Nosema, and try to keep it under  control.
 
The Nosema/pathogen combo may be a marker, they could cause CCD, or  they 
could be a consequence of CCD - whichever, we always see the pair in  failing 
colonies.
 
In the meantime, I'm going to frame my rejection from Science - I am  still 
amazed that a Science editor would offer as a reason for rejecting the  
manuscript: Publishing an alternative hypothesis to IAPV, would just  muddy the 
waters.
 
Glad Galileo didn't have to try publishing with them.  Reason we've  turned 
to a different journal.
 
Jerry

             ***********************************************
The BEE-L mailing list is powered by L-Soft's renowned
LISTSERV(R) list management software.  For more information, go to:
http://www.lsoft.com/LISTSERV-powered.html

Access BEE-L directly at:
http://community.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-LSOFTDONATIONS.exe?A0=BEE-L

ATOM RSS1 RSS2