From: randy oliver <[log in to unmask]>

>There are actually other ways than the Bond method, although that
method is the simplest, and the one that occurs in nature.

well, i'm having a hard time imagining any method who's predictions will correlate near 100% with the bond method.  we keep bees in nature (well, our own corrupted version of nature) with whatever management practices we use.  if success is survival, i can't imagine a method that can predict survival accurately.

>...survival depends a great deal upon
the type of operation that we are talking about.  

i'm concerned about long term survival and a largely self contained operation.  i expect that people with different goals figure out what is best for them in their circumstances.

>...how we keep beekeepers in business as we and nature shift toward mite resistant genetics. 

for the time being, the way we grow food in this country will keep beekeepers in business even if more and more packages come from australia.  but in the end, it really is up to the industry and individual business owners to keep beekeepers/themselves in business.

i wish no one any ill will, but especially since the mites came, u.s. beekeepers have largely (not universally) chosen quick fixes for short term gains.  this is not sustainable, and in any capitalistic system, cannot go on forever (especially if there are other possibilities).  south africa seems to have taken short term losses by not introducing varroa treatments in the first place.  i just pray that beekeeping doesn't go the way of the auto industry (govt takeovers).

with that said, i have no answers for what other beekeepers should do.  i'm doing what seems best for me to do given my situation (no kids, tenants that pay our mortgage, a small number of hives that have never been treated, and low overhead).  i'm betting that this will pay off in the long run, and i hope that what we are doing helps other beekeepers in the long run.  if i had 20,000 hives with contaminated comb, high operating costs, and kids in college i don't know what i would do...but if such beekeepers are having problems, they need to do something.  if they are not having problems, then the topic is moot.


>On another subject that you touched upon, my remaining colonies on
HoneySuperCell simply refuse to die, and are generally good producers.
 I have no idea why, since all other researchers trials with small
cell indicate that the cell size (in wax combs) does not effect mite
resistance.

a few thoughts on this:

1. my reading of the report on your website led me to believe that all the hsc hives were dead.  in rereading, i can see where there is room in the language for some hsc hives to still be surviving, but it was far from clear (to me).

2. most who are finding success with sc comb (hsc or otherwise) don't treat at all.  using fumidil and treating the bulk bees for mites before installing is exactly what i wouldn't do.

3. the other trials that i've read (and your study) are not looking for mite resistance at all!  they are looking at mite reproduction only.  as i think peter pointed out, there is a difference between "mite tolerance" and "low mite reproduction rate".  in your study, you were looking at mite reproduction rate as well....but if we are to assume that you were using enough hives in your study to demonstrate anything, then you seem to have inadvertently demonstrated straight up survival.  as far as i know, none of the other studies out there have been run in such a way to look at survival.  better look out, or you will soon be labeled as a member of the small cell cult!

4.  this seems to be (at least to me) a very important data point.  i assume that you continue to use no mite treatments on these hives???  how do these hives compare (now that they are finishing up their 3rd year) to other hives you are running?  are these the only hives you have where mite treatments are not used?  how does it compare to them?





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