"For the two pesticides that can interact with the fungicides (acetamiprid and thiacloprid), the result of making them "a thousand times more toxic" would make these pesticides only between one 10th and one 100th as toxic as most of the pesticides "of concern" to beekeepers, such as Imidacloprid"

Right.  Good point.

Dick has pointed out that the big obstacle to "toxicity in the field" for some of these compounds is the way they travel through soil, tissues, and so on.   He says some otherwise very toxic things are actually unable to pass through the gut in some cases, making them fairly harmless.  If they cannot get to the target cells they don't harm the animal.

Conversely, I know that designer compounds that DO penetrate into the body are often difficult for the animal to break down.   

It's mind-bogglingly complicated.  I can easily imagine that just one simple tweak, such as a change in pH, could affect the dynamics and transform something harmless into a dangerous poison indeed.  Even with my college-student level chemistry I know that is easily demonstrated.  

I spent a ridiculous amount of time last night going through websites on these compounds and then going through the Bee-L archives to see which beekeepers had complaints about which pesticides/fungicides.  What a mess....the subject threads on Bee-L are often way off base from the actual topic, another reminder that we should switch subject headings.  I gave up trying to be thorough, but I did find some interesting information that I will share under another thread "DMI Fungicides and Cyano-substituted Neonics".

How's that for clarity of topic heading?

On that thread we can decide if what I found is mere coincidence, or worth further investigation.

Christina



    
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