Hi All,
Jim questioned my statement:
>> it's generally accepted that honeybees can disrupt  ecosystems by 
>> pollinating exotic weeds, and by  competing with native pollinators for 
>> resources.
I'm not interested in digressing.  I'm not a native pollinator lobbyist, but
I certainly support them, and anyone else, who is working for sustaining
biodiversity on this planet.
I heard a presentation by Adrian Wenner about his part in restoration of the
native flora on a Calif channel island.  A key component was the removal of
honeybees, since the pollinated the European weeds.
I recently heard a presentation by Eric Mussen on native pollinators, in
which he spoke of their temporary resurgence when feral honeybee populations
were first decimated by varroa.
I think that both of these points are easy to grasp, and hardly "counter
intuitive."


> By pollinating these "weeds", the honey bees  assure that there will be 
> more of them, thus INCREASING  the total number of pollen and nectar 
> sources for all
 pollinators, both honey bees and others.
That may have an effect on the next year's crop, but competition for nectar
and pollen might affect native species this year.


>  Sorry,  the native pollinators are also opportunists, and will  be happy 
> to gather nectar and pollen wherever they  can, without regard to the 
> preferences of humans.
Jim, I'm not a native pollinator expert.  But my understanding is that
native pollinators are often species specific, whereas honeybees are more
generalists.


> To go further, if honey bees could somehow be "competing  for resources" 
> with native pollinators, the worst damage  to the native pollinator 
> populations would have happened  in the period between the 1600s and the 
> 1980s
No doubt.  I don't think that the resource competition thing is a big
issue--the presence of honeybees is generally accepted, except in specific
settings such as the channel island in Calif.  However, if a native species
in a limited range is threatened, some honeybee mitigation may well be
indicated.


> I'd be happy  to walk through any suburb and bet some serious money  what 
> a few hours wandering would yield in this area  of inquiry.
A recent study, which I can't find, found native pollinators to be thriving
in a suburban area.  Jim, I'm not understanding your point in this.  I don't
think anyone is calling for the elimination of honeybees!

> And what happened to the claim that native pollinators are somehow "more 
> versatile"?
Are you purposely trying to be obtuse?  The versatility did not apply to an
individual species, but all species as a group.  Some work in cold weather,
some in warm, some on certain flowers, some in odd ways.  That kind of
versatility.  Honeybees are clearly the most versatile as a species.  It
seems that you're trying to produce and argument where none existed!

Jim, I'm not at all interested in speaking for native pollinators.  I
believe that we're digressing from the issue at hand.  I only got into this
discussion when you blamed NP groups for short circuiting immediate funding
for CCD research.  This issue is about the political practices of people,
not about the insects!  If the PEOPLE did indeed hamper us, I'd be the first
to write them to ask them to stop.  If they didn't, I think that you owe
them an apology for your criticism of them.

Randy Oliver

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