Maybe the prepotency comes from the breader or beekeeper doing hard choices?


On Fri, Dec 16, 2016 at 1:03 PM, randy oliver wrote:

>  I can only speak for myself, but can assure you that Dick also has a deep
> understanding of the subject.  There are of course plenty of linkages and
> non-random genetic operators.  I am in no way disputing that.
>
>
After transposon came to my knowledge I stop trying to understand
http://www.nature.com/scitable/topicpage/transposons-the-jumping-genes-518
still playing god and selecting, but with not much hope of finding what I
am not that sure I look for.

So one thing at a time using basic basics while gathering information and
doing fine tunning. This is for lowering agrressivity in the Peruvian
stock. Masal selection of by the eyes of the beekeepers for
"north-europeization": the darkest the better. Set up of a queen breeding
program and second selection: High higienic behaviour and calm. No drone
control while producing drones from selected  colonies.

Now want to try some morphometry as a what we have? and if possible fine
tunne by a couple of parametres.


*If you were able to risk all your queens, would you do wing morphometry
with queen's forewing or you will stick to workers' forewing? If workers'
wing to be used , how many are enough to describe a colony? 10? What about
doing drone wing morphometry?*

For "europeization" of local stock we have been selecting for "carniolan
like" queens. Dark is the norm and they actualy calmed down and we were
able to form proper apiary sites rather than the usual let put one hive
more than 25 metres apart from the next one proper of africanized areas.

We are quite isolated in a 5x10 km dessert area with not much feral stock
while some semipermanent beekeeper neighbour that come for pollination
services. We plan to take those in the near future to have better control
of mating areas.

After reading a bit about the use of morphometry for stock selection and
having in mind that lowering of aggressive behaviour is my only north for
the moment and my biass is carniolans less agressive than AMM and AHB, I
tend to flavour discoidal shift as a selecting single parametre. Should I
used also cubital index? African (scutellata and others) and AMM are know
(or selected) for a negative discoidal shift while ligustica and carniolans
have a positive one.  http://www.bees.me.uk/Bees/Morphometry.html

Cubital index doesn't have that sharp definition.

On the other hand, how do discoidal shift angle compares to the clasical
Ruttner/Goetze wing angles B4, N23 and O26 ? I mean easier to measure one
rather than 3 angles.

I have no idea of the results we are going to get but be sure that we can
do morphometry for each of the 5000 or so colonies we are going to have by
march 2017. The question is, is it worth the effort? In there a parametre
that discrimate for calmness?

Let say we find a clear difference on discoidal shift, extreme possitive
and negatives. Would you cull the negatives? Or move colonies so all
possitive/negative lives on apiaries with similar parametres? and then
observe if there is noticeable difference in aggressivity.

Open to all opinions ...

Further reading
http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00218839.2002.11101071
(downloaded via sci-hub )
http://www.apidologie.org/articles/apido/pdf/1978/04/Apidologie_0044-8435_1978_9_4_ART0008.pdf
http://www.bees.me.uk/Bees/Morphometry.html
http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S1807-86722015000100091
http://www.cybis.se/cbeewing/pertxt/
http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/13102818.2010.10817877
http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S1415-47572000000200012

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