>I hope that Bob comments because his insights into such situations are
>always dead-on and he often spots things I miss.

   Wintering bees in Northern climates has been the subject of most likely
the largest number of bee articles every written on bees. Also a subject I
have never did an article on and have only jumped in a a few occasions on
BEE-L but will add my views. My experience pales in comparison to Allen's
and those beekeepers along the Canada line.
Missouri is an area in which we can winter with only a few requirements. 200
miles north is a very different story. From the Nebraska/South Dakota line
north most commercial beekeepers head south ( and for very good business
reasons).

To address Bills chimney effect my answer goes back to the old timers. I am
a old timer but older than me. The old timers preferred the 8 frame hive.
When commercial beekeepers moved  to 10 framers ( instead of 8 frames) one
of the problems suggested by the 8 framers was that the bees would chimney
through the boxes. Having ran both styles I agree the *normal* size of a
winter cluster is such that the bees will tend to progress up leaving filled
comb on both sides of each box as they proceed up. In areas with breaks in
winter such as Missouri many times when the bees hit a loose cluster they
will move the honey from those side frames into the cluster but in a hard
winter many times the cluster simple moves up and once the cluster arrives
in the top box the frames of honey in the bottom boxes will only be used
*if* a warm day happens in winter and the bees *break cluster*. Wrapping and
providing top insulation helps slow the effect. top insulation really helps
with hives in doubles in my area. An insulation which absorbs moisture is
what I like.

I have experimented with about every method for wintering I have ever read
or been told about. Marla Spivak's book *wintering in northern climates* ( I
think I have the title correct) is a great method for those wanting to
winter in 3 hive bodies. The book is around here someplace in my stacks of
bee books. Marla covers many of the subjects spoke about in this discussion.

In my own operation The first factor in wintering is a strong healthy low
varroa and nosema spore count hive (with plenty of winter bees).  Next would
be the required amount of honey for my area in a normal winter which is
suggested at 60-80 pounds *plus* around 10-20 pounds extra as a safety net
in case I can not enter  the yard in early spring (weather). 80 pounds has
worked for me most of the time.  next an area free of winter winds. My
holding yard is on the side of a valley a quarter way down the south east
slope and the area is surrounded by trees and brush to break up the winter
winds. The only drawback in my opinion is the angle of the hill but the
place the hives (4 way pallets) are located has a natural level area before
going back to a downhill slope. Next I like top ventilation in case the snow
(and ice )covers the bottom entrance. I leave an inside feeder in the top
box ( I keep the bees in two deep brood boxes). This gives me a feeder ready
to go in spring and reduces the frames in the top box to nine. ( I have used
inside feeders in both boxes but now (with less hives ) I only use a single
top box inside feeder.)  I use an inch and a half spacer for the insulation. 
I see less of a chimney effect with nine frames.
I never winter on only goldenrod honey and try to feed along while the
winter goldenrod is being collected to get some heavy syrup mixed in.  Most
winters I can get enough fall honey & syrup in the top deep to winter . I
have used a scale to check weights ( like Michael Palmer does) to determine
the amount of feed needed to get the hives to winter weight (if the bees
have not gained the required weight). However at this time many times I
simply depopulate as Allen pointed out the hive has issues and simply
filling up the hive with stores will only mean a deadout in spring full of
stored syrup. I always *try* to take my losses in fall.
After all these years now I can look at a couple frames and tilt the hive
and get a good idea of the amount of feed needed to winter. I then write the
amount of feed in gallons needed on the box. I NEVER let the help do this 
job! As the
feed truck enters the yard only the hives needing feed are fed and the
number on the lid is changed (by the help) until all the hives in the 
holding yard are up
to winter weight guess. I then come back through and check the weights 
again.
usually most my guesses have worked but there are always a few (especially
with Italians!)which need an extra gallon or two.
I feed sucrose ( .52 a pound today in bulk truck mix at International
Ingredients  and figure (with labor and trucking ) it costs between
3.50 and $4 to feed  each gallon. For years I bought HFCS for around .12
cents a pound so a gallon ( 11 pounds) of feed cost (with labor) around a
buck fifty. Back then I was not as careful with the feed as today. Syrup
cost today ( big expense for the commercial beekeeper) is two to almost
three times when you figure trucking (fuel) and what it was a decade ago.
Strong healthy hives of bees with enough honey in the right place going into
winter can usually survive in my area without most of what I think I need
but 200 miles north of me on into Canada is another matter.
We have had wind chills of -80 F.  below zero in the past and below zero
temps day and night for up to two weeks at a time. In times like those I
lose hives . I wish the hives were wrapped.
Most years i can get in and feed as early as late december or  early 
February and the bees will take the feed as we normally get a couple days in 
the upper 50's.

Hope the above helps!

Sincerely,
Bob Harrison

"barely a commercial beekeeper these days and working on reducing hive
numbers ,expanding retail & other sales and the retail orchard business.
Health issues persist"

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