On Wed, 18 Oct 2006 11:13:17 -0400, Bill Truesdell 
<[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>Organophosphates would be the key culprit on farms. They were a 
staple
>pesticide for years until exactly this problem was discovered. They 
are
>no longer allowed but are still around as exceptions. 

Organophosphates are still very much used in apple and berry 
production. California has implemented tighter controls and 
nationwide there are attempts to make them illegal but they are very 
much available and heavily used. 

Most verisons are not even on the restricted useage list so any person 
can purchase and use them. 

Bill you mentioned organic apples and spraying, excpept in drier 
climates like Washington, organic apples give about a 35% pack out 
rate compared to 80% or higher in conventional apple growing. 

As much as some "granolas" would like to claim and think otherwise 
organic apple growing is hardly economically feasible in most of the 
USA. 

I grow apples and feel that the general public needs to understand 
that in apple production there is a continuum with no spray on one end 
and heavy over use on the other. IPM works and can put a grower on 
the no spray side of the mid point of the continuum. 

The choice of pesticide and useage rate can vary considerbaly . I have 
found I can use 1/3 of the package application rate if timed well 
through the use of insect traps and have good results. 

I have had my apples tested by FDA lab and they could not detect any 
level of  the pesticide or fungicide that I used. 

I reject the notion that farm chemicals are all bad and unsafe. I've 
stated this before on this list I have 20 hives on the edge of my orchard 
year around and have not had one single problem. 

I had more trouble with aerial spraying of peas and alfalfa and my 
bees passing through the drift. . 

I find it interesting that many people have such strong opinions about 
something they have only read about. 

Even some of the materials ok for organic certification still can cause 
a problem if the spray cloud is inhaled and if concentrated amounts 
find their way into a well or body of water.  

It realy is incumbent on the grower to be resopnsible and well 
informed. I beleive that there is a massive lack of education in the 
minds of the consumer and growers about chemical useage.

I'm a firm beleiver in better living through chemistry, since if we are 
going to move towards safer ag chems it will come from the chemistry 
lab not from the Cheech & Chong crowd who want everything "natural" 
and appear sometimes to have no technical knowledge of how to 
move away from chems other then "no spray".

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