For the sake of discussion and none others wanting to join in I  will
continue presenting the other side of the issue as presented by Mitegone &
others at the ABF convention in K.C. in January. I can not stand by and let
Peters position be the only position on the subject. Formic acid discussion
at the ABF convention was heated. A majority vote was had by those in
attendance for the present resolution. In all fairness there were nay votes!

Peter:
I *meant* that for US beekeepers to use formic is illegal.

Although a complete registration of liquid formic acid for  use in bee hives
was applied for and granted  in both Canada and New Zealand none has been
applied for (to my knowledge) in the U.S. yet.

In all *other* parts of the world formic acid use is widespread and
considered a homopathec method of control such as using backing soda to
control ants. Food grade mineral oil use is not registered for use in bee
hives but widely accepted as a legal homopathec use.

Medhat N. (of our list) has given many talks in the U.S. about the safe way
formic acid is used in Canada and has stated many times it is  his opinion
formic acid could be the solution we are looking for. Medhat even invented a
pad method of dispensing for Canada.

Peter said:
 Anyway, YOU are responsible if you contaminate your honey with an
unapproved product or if you exceed the limits of one that is aproved.

Most people which have looked at formic acid use (myself)  see little chance
of contamination and testing in Canada  have proven those people to be
correct.

Dr. Shiminuki (ret. head of USDA bee labs) said many times that formic acid
was far less likely to contaminate honey and wax than  any chemical strips
which we might use (apistan & checkmite).

*Bob always not afraid to put the situation in a way All can understand*

Dr. Shiminuki was afraid  *to put things bluntly* that the U.S. beekeeper
would not be able to safely *handle* liquid formic acid without problems.
Apparently we are not as capable as Canada & New Zealand beekeepers so we
need to be protected from ourselves!

Peter said:
I think formic is a good product and should be made available, prepackaged.
I think beekeepers should wait till it is available.

What if safe packaging of formic acid does not happen and although
registered never sees the market.? Sadly the private predictons  of several
researchers (at the start) about there  never being  a way to safely package
a formic acid gel has been true so far. After all formic acid gel was a
dream of Dr. Shiminuki (excellent idea by the way) but said  unworkable and
dangerous by many other researchers privately then and even today.

My only problem with the formic acid gel as registered was that it did not
work as per label (one packet) for our area . Even Bob Stevens in his
"Betterbee" catalog(at the time) recommmended two packets per treatment for
maximum control. I believe the new label will say two packets instead of one
packet but could be wrong.

Important:
If the formic acid gel ever  finds its way to the market and works then I
would certainly endorse its use!

Peter said:
I have met hundreds of beekeepers and the majority of them seem to think
that they should apply whatever treatments and chemicals they feel likem,
govt. be damned. I don't agree with this philosophy.

I agree completely! Certain beekeepers using various sheep dips have caused
much grief on our industry. Only when one of those beekeepers comes in
contact with a knowledgeable person like myself do they realize the  errors
of their ways. I have opened many eyes! Quite a bit of very bad information
is passed from beekeeper  to beekeeper at meetings. A few beekeepers are
having to replace all the comb in their hives right now because of illegal
use of a coumaphos product. It always amazes me when beekeepers which can
afford legal treatments  risk their whole operation on illegal methods
which they would have found out by simply attending a national meeting or
asking  a inspector does not work and has been found to cause contamination
of both honey and beeswax..

Important:
Unlike most which would not enter the above debate I will share my knowledge
of the subject. Checkmite & mite resistant bees are still working for me so
my back is not up against the wall like many beekeepers in the south east
U.S.. I could however be looking for another control within months if
coumaphos resistant mites arrive in my area.
I do support and voted for the resolution made at the ABF convention by the
commercial beekeepers group that the ABF push for complete registration for
formic acid     (or at least a clarification by the USDA that use of formic
acid liquid in bee hives is homeopathic as put for by many).

Registration already exists for formic acid gel.

Bob

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