Allen:
>CCD may or may not be a real syndrome
5-10% excess mortality isn't real enough?
USA & Can thats 150-300K hives
Whats a hive worth?
There may be exposure to only 1/3 of the total pop
(migatory and/or within 3 mi of a "hot spot")
If it becomes widespread, what then?
>keeping ........quite well funded
I thought this was the problem?


OK Jim, here's my list of symptoms
I, at least, have been paying attention
These are nearly all cool weather crashes

 	Gross symptoms
1) Empty hive, no adults
occasionaly a small frozen cluster that
didn't all reach flee stage at once
Dead brood is left uncleaned in a 
minority of cases
In all cases few bees on BB (typ 1 cup)

2) Bees flee hive even when cold
No circle or return

3)Birds hanging around to eat chilled bees above
Under bird perches are abdomens, see below

4)Foul feaces (because of damaged guts)
If you doubt, pull last segment -- phew

	Individual symptoms
5)STR (sore tummy rub, because of damaged guts)
common, variable (extreme w/ staggers to pefunctory &
moderate)

6) Ankle rub (less common, definitive IMO)
misnomer, whole lower rear leg

7) (rear) feet too close (less common)
4mm or <

8)Hoppers (common at very low level
rare at noticable level)

9) Paralyzed rear legs (rare)
Only easily seen on flat

	Brood symptoms
10) 98-99% mortality 1-1.5 d larvae (rare)
If the very last seal, then they die as pupae
Daily inspection of course for 7 d or >

11)Patches of dead pupae (rare?)
10 "^2 or > These are coloured, some emergents. 
Reluctence to clean these corpses

	Other symptoms
12) If you are insane enough to raise Qs from
a ccd hive the developement is wrong, too long
You will get NO Qs in the end, all sealed die in cells
The royal jelly is bland, I'd bet $ pH is +3 from normal

13) Trucking is likley to turn a mild case into an acute case

14) Moderate dysentry due to ccd, not associated with nosema
(which I supposedly do not have -- 13+ hives tested)

15) Ants can be infected with ccd, reccover the next year

16)Avoidence of deadouts, the honey is safe, nothing wants it
exception: Already infected bees don't avoid robbing in fall,
then mob mentality takes over


Curious that no one wants samples from me,
I had to bug OBA to come and of course they have no test for ccd

I would much rather not have experienced this, most
demoralizing to see the poor response, both from
TPTB and this very BBS


dave

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