>The issue in my opinion is as Jim points out about 2,4,5-T in the 60's sold

> to the general public and the maker saying safe for home use.
> How did the product get by the EPA?
>

Good golly Bob, could you please do even minimum fact checking before you
hit "send"?

"Born in the wake of elevated concern about environmental pollution, EPA
was established on December 2, 1970"  (http://www.epa.gov/history/).  It is
hard to regulate if you haven't even been yet created.


>The cleanup at Times Beach Missouri ( 27 acres from memory) cost 100
million

> dollars of which U.S. taxpayers  ( you and I ) paid 90 million dollars.
>

>the city of Times Beach hired waste hauler Russell Bliss to oil the roads
in and around the town in 1971. From 1972 to 1976, Bliss sprayed waste oil
on the roads at a cost of six cents per gallon used.  The problem began
when Bliss took a contract with a local company called ICP to dispose of
toxic waste. ICP was being paid $3,000 per load to remove toxic waste from
Northeastern Pharmaceutical and Chemical Company. ICP in turn paid Bliss
$125 to eliminate the waste.  In late 1979, a NEPACCO employee confessed
the company's practice of disposing of dioxin. The government sued NEPACCO
in 1980...Subsequent research on the effects of dioxin on humans and other
mammals has led some experts to question whether the evacuation of the town
was necessary, sometimes citing the example of Seveso, Italy, the site of a
disaster in1976 that exposed residents to larger levels of dioxin than
those of Times Beach. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Times_Beach,_Missouri)


Bob, the Times Beach incident was an illegal act.  I can't think of anyone
who would not condemn such blatant environmental pollution.

> >I come from a long line of farmers and I believe John Deere could come up
> with a mechanical machine to pull through a corn field as we did with the
> old cultivators till the corn plants were higher than the weeds.
>

I'm in complete agreement, and see robotic weeding devices, rather than
herbicides, as the future.

>
> >Lets start getting farmers off the chemical treadmill.


Also in complete agreement!


> >Think of the profits in farming if the farmer did not have to buy seeds


No farmer needs to buy seeds.  That is a choice.  Any farmer is free to
save seed, provided it is not a patented variety.  They purchase seeds
because of the choice in varieties, the consistency of the seed, and
because they feel that it is more cost effective.

>
> >No IPM in today's farming.


Also agreed (for some areas).  With some crops in some areas, IPM is widely
practiced, with great success.  These success stories should be promoted by
beekeepers.

Bob, we have far more in common in our opinions than you make out.  My only
wish is that you check the "facts" that you post.

--
Randy Oliver
Grass Valley, CA
www.ScientificBeekeeping.com

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