Roger Hecht <[log in to unmask]> wrote:j

>I can't say whether the Planets influenced the great 20th century English
>composers, but the dates of composition are right (1914-16), and I hear
>more Holst in VW, et al.  than I do Elgar.

No doubt one of the erudite Listers from BMUSIC will give a full reply,
but I wonder whether the Holst you hear in RVW is not in reality the
traditional / folk influence to be found in both.  The English folk
movement was very pronounced, - not a casual thing, with much serious
effort put in by Cecil Sharp et al to preserve the tradition before it
was submerged in social change.  Both RVW and Holst collected and arranged
a number of these tunes, and incorporated them in longer pieces.  Some
tunes were popular with both and occur in the work of both men.

The recent Pearl CD devoted to historic RVW recordings gives a powerful
insight to the movement in its heyday.  It was a major force and influenced
a great many, including Bax, Delius, and Grainger among others.  The
influence on Elgar, however, is less evident, perhaps being a little
after his time.  Cecil Sharp's English Folk Song and Dance Society
(still very much with us, and headquartered in N.W.  London) was almost
evangelical in its zeal to spread traditional song and dance, encouraging
the re-introduction of maypole dancing, and the like.  As late as the '40s
and '50s city kids in primary schools (grade schools) like myself were
being drilled in "traditional country dancing" using material emanating
from Cecil Sharp House.

Thanks to the movement important heritage material has been preserved, and
we may all enjoy the tunefulness of it as well as gaining insights into the
classical music of the period.  Thus, for example, do we learn a lot about
the origins and similarities of the Appalachian tradition, leading us on to
Copland, etc.

For better or worse England probably now has more Morris Dancing sides /
Clog Dancers / Coconut Dancers / Wassailers / etc.,than at any earlier time
in its history!

Keith.