Danielle Woerner responds to my comment that modern CM composers, who
stray farther and farther into the ritualistic aesthetic of World music,
(performer and audience are one), may not take into consideration the
fact that their music may lose its potency when presented in a "Western
European" format--(performers separate from a silent, non-participating
audience.)

>as for whether one might be happier participating in music of Cage, Reich,
>at al., ca depend.  Cage used silence and shock (and sometimes, silence as
>a shock) in so much of his music that to participate audibly would mean to
>lose the impact and message.

I believe that Cage used the silence so that the ambient noise of the
audience and of the room would become the music.  (As opposed to Debussy
and Wagner who used silence to emphasize tonal ambivalence.) Danielle
illustrates my point perfectly--that Cage is inviting a formerly bound and
gagged European-style audience to become *one* with the performer again.

Some of us are unhappy with Modern CM because we feel silly listening to
it--Cage, Reich, (and even Carter--I'll explain in a minute), look great in
their flowery Hawaiian shirts and sandals, but they're wearing them back in
our ivory towers and castles--all we can say is, "yeah dude, I can respect
your lifestyle," but then giggle amongst ourselves.

I have a hunch that as our Western CM becomes more worldly, or
improvisational, the more it will need audience participation to remain
a potent experience for all.  It will, (and has), become too casual and
free to satisfy the kind of expectations that are met when we listen to a
Beethoven symphony, and yet we are denied the only other pleasure that this
kind of music offers us--participation.  As a Western CM audience member,
we must remain silent, (or else be glared at by the old ladies--as if their
coughing wasn't annoying enough!)

I would also say that, ironically, the more serialist and rhythmically
complex our music becomes, the more *it* approaches an improvised,
World-music sound; and once again the music loses potency, not because
of a lack of quality, but for the reason mentioned above.

John, once again uncovering another elusive philisophical truth, Smyth