Mmm How do I suck up the resources of fellow students? If I save my money and choose to spend it somewhere such as a conference that is my right. When I choose to give to charities to support different organizations that help the homeless and unemployed that is my right. When I ride in Charity rides to raise money for children with cancer it is my right. But my deciding to do these things is all about me doing what I feel is needed to make myself a more complete human being. It is not about evolving. It is not about being selfish or making myself feel good. Making yourself feel good, sounds more like what you are preaching. It sounds like someone feels guilty and therefore must make others feel the same way. If I utilize money I work hard to get to allow myself to attend a couple of conferences a year that is my right to do so and it does not in any way deny someone else their life or their home. My decision to spend money at a conference does the opposite of that. Some of that money pays for the salaries of people who work in the hotels where the conferences are held. If all conferences ended there would be thousands of more people out of work not to mention many hotels would go out of business. The loss to local economies would be affected creating more unemployed people and potentially more homeless people. Your argument does not provide a solution all you are providing is criticism and it something you do every time there is a posting about a conference that you feel is overpriced and unfair because you cannot afford to go. If I as a graduate student who is paying for my education can save the money to go by being smart about what I spend and how I choose to afford to get there, then anyone who wants to can do the same. Many of the graduate students in my department attend conferences and we work together to get each other there. We share rooms and rides to attend. But in no way does my attending prohibit them or inhibit their access to resources. By trying to link our professional desires to something that we cannot control or affect is disingenuous at the least and trying to claim that people are doing without because I choose to attend a conference is just a blatant attempt to hide the fact that you have no real solution to the problem you claim exists. As I stated previously, instead of castigation why don't you provide the solution. Do the research and provide the information that gives us the resources to provide another avenue for meeting. If you really want to make a difference then step down from your soapbox and provide sources and avenues for doing what you think will work and we can then discuss the alternative. You need to provide a concrete path to the a technology based conference that will meet the needs of everyone you suggest would want access. You need to provide statistical information that supports your conjecture. Until you do so and can do it with clear answers and solutions that can be economically implemented you need to accept that there will be a difference of opinion and accept the fact that many of us professionals do still rely on the personal contact between humans to share information and ideas versus just using wires and LED screens. As I tell my students. Communications avenues have changed over the last 40 years but not always for the better as many people today do not have the common ability to sit and talk with someone, drive, walk or ride over and visit with someone in person as they prefer to hide behind a screen. And that has led to a loss of social etiquette and collegiality that is slowly dying among the more connected generations. There is still nothing as personal or fulfilling as being able to sit down with someone over a drink and have a relaxed conversation about a topic or subject of interest. Something that cannot be done via technology.
Lewis C Jones
PhD. Candidate IUB / Adjunct Faculty IUPUI
Indiana University
Anthropology Department
Student Building 130
701 E. Kirkwood Avenue
Bloomington, IN 47405-7100
USA
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-----Original Message-----
From: HISTORICAL ARCHAEOLOGY [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of sent
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 10:28 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Why YOU should come to SHA Quebec 2014
Again matters not who pays what- ok instead of wasteful outdated extravagant conferences each and every one donate the same money to a fund to preserve, and create jobs and help the resource- IMHO that’s where the money is needed and not in the stupid conference industry.....just my opinion.....
I condemn stupidity in the face of need and want unemployment and homelessness and for me the work comes first not some silly conference.....
In our present economic climate such diversion of money to conferences is cruel, inhumane ill advised- shame be on such waste!
Remember doing with out conferences does not in any way mean limiting communication and information exchange or learning.
Having to find other less expensive forms would actually mean more exchange and more communication
Simply put EVOLVE
And have compassion for those out of work, for the resource and for new students who's jobs and resources you are sucking up- just to feel good!
Turn around now- the public is watching-people are doing without so you can feel good
Shame
Conrad Bladey
Archeologist
peasant
-----Original Message-----
From: Lewis C Jones
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 10:03 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Why YOU should come to SHA Quebec 2014
Conrad,
You argue that we should think of the homeless and unemployed as getting rid of conferences is needed to preserve jobs, but the fact remains that you don't have to go to a conference if you don't want to and if you really believe that getting rid of conferences will create jobs then you need to show us the research that supports this claim as I don’t tend to feel that it is the case. All professions and I consider anthropology a profession and not just a job, have conferences to exchange ideas and to get the latest information going on in the field. Can we try and provide some of this electronically? Yes and it is being done. But technology is not something that is altogether user friendly and to have the ability to do what you suggest would mean a great amount of money to create the infrastructure needed. Are you willing to provide that startup capital? Do you have any idea of what it costs to have the technology along with the redundancy needed to prevent potential gli tches and loss of connectivity that can occur with something as simple as a solar flare ? Technology cannot at this time provide the same access for large amounts of people to connect as a conference can and does provide. I speak on this as someone who worked for over 15 years in IT before going
back to school to become an anthropologist. I suggest that before you
condemn us for attending conferences that instead you come up with a viable alternative providing research and data that shows that it can be done and done economically and without needs to raise hundreds of thousands if not millions of dollars to create the dedicated technology that would be needed to host such a meeting. Yes the technology does exist but not at a price our professional organizations could afford after all we don't have stock holders or even a products that generates hundreds of millions of dollars that would be needed. If your real complaint is that you don't go to conference's because you t hink it is too expensive, well then that is a valid argumen!
t for wh
y you don't attend, but that doesn't mean you have the right to vilify and criticize those of us who save up to go to the few conferences we choose to attend. I am not rich by any means and choose where and when to go and choose based upon my interests. What we pay for conference attendance is actually quite small compared to other professions. My spouse is a veterinarian and when she attends a conference she pays for it, sometimes her clinic might help with travel, but the bulk of it is on her and as a professional she is required to attend conference's as that is where she can learn about the newest information for her field and gain continuing education -credit. Her cost for just the conference is about 5 - 6 times what we pay and I am basing this on the non-student rate. Their hotel costs are higher as well and they understand that it is part of being a professional. We are not the only profession with conferences, but we are one of the few that does try to keep the co sts low and look for venues and times that will make it more affordable to all. As a student I have paid for my conferences and there are times when I have volunteered to help to help lower my costs as well. But in the end it is my choice to go or not and no one makes us pay to go to a conference it is something we choose to do and in my case I choose to go because I feel it allows me to network and become more closely connected with current and future colleagues and collaborators on the work we should love to do because it is a calling and not a job.
Lewis C Jones
PhD. Candidate IUB / Adjunct Faculty IUPUI Indiana University Anthropology Department Student Building 130
701 E. Kirkwood Avenue
Bloomington, IN 47405-7100
USA
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tel:
fax:
mobile:
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(812) 855-1041
(812) 855-4358
(317) 490-2047
clovis_cathmor
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-----Original Message-----
From: HISTORICAL ARCHAEOLOGY [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of sent
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 9:13 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Why YOU should come to SHA Quebec 2014
Of course you can do what you want- but think of the unemployed, the homeless and the needs of the resource before you attend or support spending of this magnitude simply to communicate, which can be done easily, simply-without great expense.
Why are we creating jobs in the convention and entertainment industry when our obligation is to create jobs in archeology and spend our money on our obligations to the resource. Absurd!
If you stay away the only losers will be the fat cat hotel and conference people-believe me they don’t put THEIR money into archeology!
Other equally wonderful channels of communication will easily take its
place- there will be no information lost, Just jobs maintained and
created- work can be funded, the resource needs addressed- or well then you can just have a good time.....go figure...please!
It is far too big a slice of funds available these days to remain so. Our public deserves economy. We have to do more with less, we have to do the same with less. Cut now before we loose more jobs and opportunities.
Conrad Bladey
Archeologist
Peasant
-----Original Message-----
From: Timothy K. Perttula
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 6:20 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Why YOU should come to SHA Quebec 2014
A lot of time and wasted e-mail ink has been spent discussing this issue. It is a professional and personal decision about whether one attends a conference like SHA or not. If someone doesn't want to attend, so be it.
It serves no purpose to castigate those that will choose to attend SHA.
Those that do not intend to come to the conference: fine, we get it, move on.
There must be a better historical archaeology thread out there than this.
Tim
-----Original Message-----
From: Elizabeth Davoli <[log in to unmask]>
To: HISTARCH <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Wed, May 15, 2013 2:18 pm
Subject: Re: Why YOU should come to SHA Quebec 2014
Berating colleagues for attending conferences has yet to eliminate conferences.
Some archaeologists choose to belong to organizations funded by the collection of dues, others don't. Some BA/BS degree holders choose to enroll in a graduate program to earn a higher degree, others don't.
Some college graduate archaeologists choose a career with private contracting firms, others choose a career in government (local, state, or federal), and others choose to work in a completely different field.
If one chooses not to attend a conference, is there an expectation that others must abide by that choice and not attend?
Liz
On Wed, 15 May 2013 16:56:49 -0400, sent <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>Again sacrificing jobs and research for the feel good of human contact
>I cant see why this justifies such sacrifice.
>As you point out the job can be done with electronic communication
>
>We owe the public the most inexpensive solution and it has been
demonstrated
>that traditional
>conferencing is the most expensive solution for doing the same thing-
>communicating and discussing.
>
>If you want face to face discover free good and easy skype
>
>If you want to exhange papers and even co author them use google docs
>
>for recreation and travel- well use your own money- or volunteer to do
>archeology in a nice setting
>
>Easy
>
>Conrad Bladey
>Archeologist
>Peasant
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: [log in to unmask]
>Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 4:50 PM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: Why YOU should come to SHA Quebec 2014
>
>I really have to weigh in here. I know what it was like to attend
>virtually no conferences early in my career and what it is like to do
at
>least two
>per year now (ACRA and SHA, sometimes SAA). Both my business and my
>company's work has improved dramatically, with a lot of that due to
face to
>face
>interaction with people in the field. I have picked up many innovative
>ideas, made many changes in the way that I do work and just became more
>enthused with archaeology on a regular basis by attending and
participating
>(an
>important component - giving papers, participating in symposia, doing
>posters, serving the organizations on committees and as officers,
etc. - I
>was
>chair of the 1999 SHA Conference in Salt Lake City).
>
>While I have not expected to generate new work from these attendances,
it
>has happened over the years. I also have, no doubt, that there have
been
>projects we have done that have been the result of farther flung
>connections made at conferences that I have no idea came from there.
>
>Electronic communication is wonderful and a great way to share specific
>information and keep in touch, but humans are humans. There is no
>substitute for person to person interaction, body language, interacting
>with
multiple
>people at once, experiencing the book room, personally interacting with
>people who create posters, the venue and city in which the conference
is
>held. Getting to know archaeologists, historians, architectural
historians
>and
>others over the years has enhanced my understanding of and joy in the
>profession, made my work better, and generated friendships for my wife
>(also an
>archaeologist) and myself that I would not trade for all of the
electronic
>communications available, hands down.
>
>Mike Polk
>Sagebrush Consultants, L.L.C.
>Ogden, Utah
>
>
>In a message dated 5/15/2013 2:05:07 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time,
>[log in to unmask] writes:
>
>Exactly it is black and white that is why it is so important. We have
more
>ways to promote interaction other than conferencing than ever in
>history-why are we using this expensive method which takes jobs and
>detracts from our ability to
address
>the research?
>
>Communication is communication- all the things you mention can be
>generated by electronic communication-its easy-
>
>It is like people are insisting that we put our postal mail back on
horses
>and stage coaches because it feels better- terrible foundation for the
>argument for communication!
>
>
>Conrad Bladey
>Archeologist
>Peasant
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Kimberly Wooten
>Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 2:36 PM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: Why YOU should come to SHA Quebec 2014
>
>That's your black and white argument. I think the flip side being that
>attendance at conferences generates new ideas, enthusiasm, and
>professional contacts, all of which lead to funding and preservation
opportunities, and
>if I enjoy myself, regardless of the personal finical decisions I
make to
>attend a conference (locally or internationally), so much the better.
VTCs
>are another option, happen frequently where I work, and are often
employed
>in conjunction with professional meetings. The point of my message
was to
>be
>supportive of a peer charged with the task of promoting an important
>conference. Kimberly
>
>
>
>> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 14:10:36 -0400
>> From: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: Why YOU should come to SHA Quebec 2014
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>
>> So the fun and travel is worth limiting funding, employment and
>necessary
>> conservation and fieldwork?
>>
>> Look into the many ways you can do really clear visual and audio
>> conferencing-free
>>
>> Conrad
>>
>> Thank you in advance for your prompt response!
>>
>>
>> On May 15, 2013, at 1:48 PM, Kimberly Wooten
<[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Let me try this again... As archaeologists, it is almost a given
that
>> > most of us are not living the high life. I admit it can be a
financial
>
>> > strain on my family to attend a conference, but we choose to do
this;
>we
>> > can't always attend annually and are careful with those meetings
we do
>> > attend. The SHA meetings in York, England, several years ago were
>> > wonderful and nothing can compare to meeting people face-to-face,
>having
>> > my enthusiasm for my chosen field renewed by this contact and some
>> > excellent presentations, all wrapped in the bonus visiting
beautiful
>> > places. Technology has its important uses, but its limits as
well. I
>for
>> > one, will be happy to attend the meetings in Quebec City. Kimberly
>> >
>> >
>> >> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 01:17:50 +0000
>> >> From: [log in to unmask]
>> >> Subject: Why YOU should come to SHA Quebec 2014
>> >> To: [log in to unmask]
>> >>
>> >> See the Society for Historical Archaeology’s latest blog, “Why
YOU
>> >> should come to Quebec in 2014”
>> >>
>http://www.sha.org/blog/index.php/2013/05/why-you-should-come-to-quebec
>-
in-2014/
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> William Moss
>> >> Conference Chair / 47th Conference on Historic and Underwater
>> >> Archaeology Président du Comité organisateur / 47e Colloque sur
>> >> l'archéologie historique et subaquatique
>> >> www.sha2014.com<http://www.sha2014.com/>
>> >
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