> I've bought bees from North of Vermont and they were a full month ahead 
> of ours here. 

Let me correct that.  The bees came from almost exactly the same latitude 
as the area where Mike operates, but at an altitude 300 feet lower.  The bees 
were in doubles, but some had been wintered in singles at Glanworth, Ontario.
That was probably 1974 or 1975.

The hives had been out of the wintering boxes for some time and had already 
built up well.  

I brought them back in late April (when we are just unwrapping here) and we 
were able to split those bees right away.  Still, they drew and filled full supers of 
foundation during the silver willow flow in early June.  Amazing!

I thought I should set that straight.  The topic interests me greatly since, for 
the past several years, I have been trying to see how much I can build up 
without  extraordinary  measures or constant tinkering.  

I confess that I have not been too serious about the task, and have been away
so much that some things which would increase the success like checking queens 
early and often were not done.  I also did not use nuc boxes, either single nucs
or of the vertical sort that Mike uses and recommends, like I have in the past.

Normally my wintering loss was around 20% and I did not have big mite 
problems, but last winter I lost 100%.  That was an oversight, as it turns out.

At any rate, Dave summed it up well, and pretty much confirmed what I had  
written at about the same time.

If it seems we are arguing with those who think we could do better, it is not 
that we are not interested and not that we would not love to raise bees on 
a successful commercial basis, but rather that we have tried many different 
ways and always found that there are risks in our region which have dulled 
the  enthusiasm  of those who have tried it.

An additional  problem for those who do manage to successfully raise nucs is 
marketing.  Most just raise  replacement  bees for themselves since selling 
them is a problem right at a very busy time of year.  In  addition  to finding 
buyers, there is the question of equipment exchange or sale etc.

One year I had nucs for sale and a buyer lined up.  He came by one cold
night in June on the way back from a long trip, lifted a few lids and decided 
they were not as strong as expected.  That night they did not look like much
but the next day they looked fine, but I was stuck with them, and he was 
short bees.

Most of us have an ideal number of hives we are set up  to run and operating
many more or many less results in inefficiencies and loss.  Packages have 
the advantage that they are standardized and transportable and there is no 
equipment involved.

At any rate, thanks to all who are contributing to this thread.  It is a topic 
of constant interest here in Western Canada.

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