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Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology

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Subject:
Re: New CCD data
From:
James Fischer <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Mon, 28 Jan 2008 11:53:20 -0500
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>> (As I explained, the gamma radiation is not going to impact 
>> pesticides on the combs at all.)

> A fellow Bee-L-er... offered a couple tidbits of info to the 
> contrary.

Yes, one could use MASSIVE amounts of radiation and break down
pesticides, but this would only be possible at several THOUSAND
times the exposure levels used in the CCD-related experiment cited.  

> The science of evaluating the optimum immune system of bees is 
> largely unexplored.

So you must agree that any further claims about bee immune systems 
would be nothing by additional pure speculation, and therefore, 
unproductive.

> Parallels to the human immune system can be drawn though.

Even though the entire subject is largely unexplored?
What level of romantic anthropomorphism is required to draw
complex connections of this sort between insects and mammals?

> And the immune system of humans is influenced by stress...
> Why would it be different for bees? 

We have no idea what "stress" is for bees, so go back to
square one, and define what you want to call "stress".
When you have something we can measure, we will discuss it.  

> Everyone is entitled to an opinion.  

Of course everyone is entitled to their own opinion,
but everyone is NOT entitled to their own facts.

> If chemotherapy and radiation for cancer weaken the human 
> immune system, pesticides in the hive can weaken the bees' 
> immune system.   

There is no basis in fact to make the comparison made above,
as comparing insects to humans is a very big jump.

Yes, pesticides can be bad for insects, as most pesticides
target insects.

And my basic point was that the irradiation would NOT have 
"decontaminated" the combs in terms of pesticides.
Pathogens certainly were eliminated.

What Bob is mentioned about Dave Hackenberg's hives seems to
conflict with the "70% survival" cited by the Penn State/
USDA group, so now I'm wondering if calibration of the gamma
beam was even done.

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