Hi Stephen & All There is a Queen excluder method that does not rely on actual gaps... It is mentioned at the bottom of the page:- http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman/excludertypes.html Regards From:- Dave Cushman, G8MZY Beekeeping and Bee Breeding, http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman IBList Archives, http://website.lineone.net/~d.cushman ----- Original Message ----- From: Stephen Augustine <[log in to unmask]>