Hello Ruary and All,
The situation might be different in Ruary's part of the world (UK and
Ireland) but in the Midwest bees store plenty of pollen in cells (with only
pollen in the cells ) in the honey supers. We simply remove the cappings and
spin the pollen out with the honey. Pressure filtering is the only means of
clearing late fall wildflower honey. In other words if its late season
wildflower without clover mixed the honey will not be clear due to suspended
pollen (much of which is from fall ragweed).

> > But the "trace amounts" of pollen in honey is going to be from the
plants where the nectar was gathered.

This is true but not the reason for the huge amount of suspended pollen in
our fall wildflower honey.

 I am beginning to think this might be only common in our area of the
Midwest as Lloyd says he can put comb honey supers right over the brood nest
in New York and not get pollen in cells. We have to always put the comb
honey super over a filled extracting super or we get hundreds of cells
filled with pollen which reduces the value of the comb honey.

> It is therefore reasonable to conclude  that honey not filtered within an
>inch of its life will contain pollen,

I agree completely!
I have sold honey in drums to many large packers and seen the 5 feet long
pressure filters in operation. They pull *all* suspended pollen from the
honey. Many do not know that suspended pollen makes honey crystalize faster.

> but
> > no pollens from "non-nectar" plants like ragweed or corn.

Sorry Ruary but in the Midwest we get pollen from both in honey. It is true
that bees only gather from one type plant at a time but when all cells are
filled in the area around the brood nest ALL POLLEN GOES UP ABOVE. As I said
above when we uncap and spin we mix the pollen with the honey. We really
have no other choice. The large packers later remove the suspended pollen
from their product but MAINLY because the suspended pollen speeds up
granulation. When you ship a semi load of bottled honey to a distributer and
he ships to a local grocery and their is not a way for granulated honey to
be exchanged you need a long shelf life. hence the pressure filtering and
pasteurizing process by the large packers.

>
> But you will also get pollen from air pollenated plants like pine in
honey.

Bees collect plenty of pollen in our area from pine trees. I have had many
discussions with fellow beekeepers over the collection of pollen and nectar
in the U.S. from pine(Pinus spp.) over the years. I first saw bees collect
pollen from pine trees as a teenager in Florida. Many beekeepers (which
still believe that all the truths about beekeeping can be found in bee
books) would show me that neither the great John Lovell (Honey plants of
North America 1926 ) or the great Frank Pellett (American Honey Plants
1920 ) listed Pine (Pinus spp.) as a source for pollen.
Finnally in June of 1971 the USDA in its publication no. 335 listed Pine
(Pinus spp.) as a source of both pollen and nectar but only in the western
U.S..
Knowing the listing would raise a roar from many beekeepers a foot note was
added pointing to the research of G.H. Vansell. Vansell also lists Pine as a
source of nectar and pollen in his publication "Nectar and pollen plants of
California pg. 55 (1931.)

As far as the nectar from Pine I do not know as I figured the bees only
collected honeydew but I do know about the collection of pollen from pine.

I am sure Ruary is correct for his area of the world and I only point out
the difference in my area of the Midwest. Ruary was a regular when I was on
the Irish bee list and is very knowledgeable on bees and beekeeping. I
quickly learned the Irish and the English have got their own ways of keeping
bees and there are many differences in the flora.
Sincerely,
Bob Harrison