If you can stand more on this subject.... I'm catching up on reading and just couldn't resist a comment. About 15 yrs. ago, when I first started working with newborns, the newbornnursery routine was NPO (Nothing By Mouth) for 24 hours for all babies...a few years later, very progressive peds started feedings at 12 hours of age. Most all those babies actually did ok (glucose/hydration, etc.) with this even though some were obviously very hungry by the first feed. The other things we did (routine supplements with glucose water, etc.) were often very detrimental to breastfeeding, and while I certainly don't ADVOCATE that kind of delay in feeding, it is a part of my perspective when I'm trying to coax a <24 hour old infant to nurse and baby just doesn't seem interested. So I tend to lay low and place baby skin to skin with mom (or dad) and keep offering frequently. Most babies come around between 18-24 hours of age. I see alot of these sleepy babies because the epidural rate in the hospital I see inpatients is well over 90% (no doulas!). On the output issue,I don't think we have ANY research on this...we all are using numbers that seem to make sense to us, but desperately need the research. I use 1 wet & 1 BM in first 24 hours, then 2-3 each wets & BMs per day until about 24 hours after milk transition (expected by 5th day). We send parents home with a screening tool that includes when milk should change/breasts get full, and what output to expect after that time (4 or more yellow BMs and 6 or more wets per day). I often write in the margin what to expect before then. The screening tool also has process indicators...how often, how long, swallowing, no excessive swelling/soreness AND a big list of community supports....adapted from Neifert's work. One pattern we seem to see is a pea soup or runny green BM right before the transition to mustardy BM's....cluster of feedings during the last 6-10 hours before milk transition, and also gassiness in babe just as milk is changing. Anyone else recognize this pattern..or are we just seeing it because we think we will?