Dear All and Elizabeth,

I apologise that any one has thought I was flaming Elizabeth or that you
felt attacked personally. I guess that I feel pretty strongly on this issue
and I quoted you back, not to offend or attack, but because it is such a
common "myth" of breastfeeding that fathers are or feel excluded by BF.

As I said in my opening post I have only been lurking here for a little
while (less than a week) and almost certainly would not have posted on any
other subject. In my defence of my post I would say that on all the other
e-mail lists I belong to this would have been considered a gentle and
considered response not a personal attack. This is how it was meant. I meant
to contribute to the discussion not attack anyone in particular.

I guess that this reminds me of the emotiveness of issues that surround BF
and the need for me to be more careful in my posting in the future,
_particularly on a subject that I am emotionally involved with_!!!!!!!!!

I guess that in the beginning when of a new child in the house/family many
of the things which need to be done are chores but that doesn't mean that
fathers cannot have time with their children which does not involve feeding.
I do most of the cooking in our house but that is because I am better at it
than my partner and enjoy it more. This does not make me a wonderful
person - I prefer my own cooking to my partners!!!

Please note that I do not clean the bathroom!!!!!!

I suspect that I was lucky in some ways that I was already comfortable with
new babies by the time we had our first ,or alternatively, I at least knew
how to change a nappy and knew how to find things in a hospital. I remember
the morning after our first had been born I returned to hospital (emergency
Caesar at 0015) at about 0800 to find him wet. I just found the nappies and
started to change him. My partner said to me later that about 2min into this
she wanted to say that she would do it!!! Because by her report she still
wanted to be with Alex. If I had been a bit unsure I would never had
finished that task. _Are partners often excluded by mistake at the earliest
moments?_


Having said all the above I apologise if I have offended anyone as that was
and is not my intention but I think that fathers do sometimes get a raw deal
that is not always of our own creation.(Please note I do not include abuse
of any kind or anything like that in this).

Phillip Sheard, RN and Generalist Community Nurse
Father of Alex, 6 and Elly 3 and partner to an NMAA counsellor


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Lactation Information and Discussion
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Elizabeth Steiner
> Sent: Wednesday, 21 April 1999 2:15
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Dads / flaming
>
>
> Dear All -- OK, I admit I may be feeling a bit sensitive and/or defensive
> right now, but I have to say I (and indirectly my dh) are feeling a bit
> flamed about the bottle feeding and nurturing issue.  In many
> ways, I think
> this is approaching the same problem as the thread about "pods" and other
> "convenience items."  That is to say, no, dads don't have to be
> able to feed
> to bond w/ their babes, but if they want to, why is that a problem?  (and
> yes, my dh *does* cook dinner, do dishes, laundry, etc -- yes, I know I'm
> blessed).  IMHO, we all know at a gut level that food is a
> critical part of
> nurturing, and for dads to recognize that there's a different kind of
> connection that comes when one feeds a baby, is a good thing.  No, every
> parent can't do the same things that the other parent does, but
> when each of
> who cares for/loves a child has an opportunity to experience some
> of the same
> joys that the other does, doesn't that benefit the whole family?
>
> And what about non-traditional families?  I have several lesbian and gay
> couples in my practice w/ children (aside -- is this an
> off-limits topic on
> this list?).  In the cases of the two women, the non-birth mom
> often fed the
> babe w/ SNS at the breast (had never lactated).  W/ the men, both
> dads wanted
> (appropriately) to feed the babes.  Of course, most adoptive
> parents do not
> choose/are not able to BF, and we don't express the belief that only the
> mothers should feed the babes in those situations.  Why should we deny
> biologic dads this opportunity?!
>
> I realize I'm getting a little hot under the collar on this
> issue, and also
> that there are probably a bunch of other issues going on in the case that
> started this discussion (the abuse potential and PPD are very
> good points),
> but I fear that once again, we may be veering onto a course that
> will take us
> away from our true goals.  OK, enough. I'll stop ventilating!
>
> Elizabeth Steiner
>
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