Dear all,
I have received personal communications which showed me I was not clear (enough) in my postings. Some people might consider my words as coming from LLL. As I consider fairly known within this group, LLL (La Leche League) is a volunteer organisation, spread out over the world, offering peer-to-peer support. As a volunteer, I underwrite the policies issued by the organisation. I do however not want to imply I speak for, or on behalf, of the organisation. I list my association with LLL as a clarification, so we all know a bit where we 'come from' - organisationwise, languagewise, countrywise, experiencewise.
I apologise for any unclarities I might have caused and created an autograph which should make things more clear.
Lydia de Raad
Volunteer counsellor La Leche League (LLL) Netherlands (Europe)
All opinions expressed in this email are my own
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: Lactation Information and Discussion [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Namens Lydia de Raad
Verzonden: donderdag 28 april 2022 11:18
Aan: [log in to unmask]
Onderwerp: Re: Paper on use of sexed language in communication on maternity
Hi Karleen,
Thank you for continuing this discussion. And you know what? I don't even know where to start in participating and letting the light fall on other aspects, as this is só multi-faceted.
First of all: your name and reputation. You are a highly respected voice in the world of IYCF, with a PhD. If and when you say or write something, people listen and consider your words deeply researched and rock-solid. When I say or write something, it is as worthy as communicating my shoppinglist. There is a difference in reception of something based on the sender.
I think this group all know what a top-notch-research looks like, and how many hours and effort go into that, and how difficult it can be. And now you present a 'paper' which you 'published' with 'colleagues'. I don't really want to go into semantics here in this multilingual forum, but this is not the way I expect an *opinion* to be presented.
I looked at the collegues who séémed to have done research together, but at the end of the article you clarify you wrote the article and had the others review it. And that is *fine*, it is perfectly listed, but just not of the quality I would expect. And yes, I know my expectations are mine and it is not up to you to live up to them.
I live in the Netherlands, a small country in the NorthWest of Europe. I am multilingual, fluent in Dutch, German and English - and manageable (reading mostly) in French, Spanish and Italian. And a tiny bit of Arabic nowadazys, as I have new neighbours. The Netherlands have in the past centuries (as many other European countries) been a colonizing country - focussing mainly on the 'East' (Indonesia) - but we did have our colonies in the USA, Latin America (Suriname) and Africa (South Africa). I don't think I can speak on how unwanted colonialism is, as I think I should shut up, take the back seat and lísten to the colonized.
When I looked at the authors, I couldn't help but noticing both you, Jenny and Hannah are white, English speaking Australian. I guess everyone knows Australia used to belong to the Aboriginals, untill England decided it was theirs. It feels weird hearing about colonialism in that light.
The same goes for Roger Mathisen, who is a white male, working in Vietnam - if we consider expat a modern form of colonialism. Nils Bergman, is a white Scandinavian doctor who did most of his work in SouthAfrica. He must surely be aware of the huge inclusive language debate within Scandinavia. Aron Gupta is in India, and as far as I know him - he is Indian. But he had to work in the language (English) of the oppressor (GB).
And no, I don't mean to be nasty or mean to people who can't help where they were born and how they look like. They are probably all fine and fantastic people doing their best. I dó however think it is weird that precisely thése people (well, except Aron I suppose) pull the 'colonialism'-card.
There is more :-) But that is for another day :-)
Lydia, LLL, Netherlands
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: Lactation Information and Discussion [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Namens Karleen Gribble
Verzonden: woensdag 27 april 2022 04:52
Aan: [log in to unmask]
Onderwerp: Paper on use of sexed language in communication on maternity
Hi Lydia,
I was interested in what you said about not being aware of any pitfalls or unintended consequences of desexing the language of female reproduction and maternity. We detailed many of these in our paper here https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fgwh.2022.818856/full <https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fgwh.2022.818856/full> and in particular in Supplementary File 1. I wondered if you hadn’t seen these or whether you didn’t think that they were a problem. I’d be very interested in hearing more about your views on this.
I am not aware of any culture or language that does not use sexed language. All have words to designate male and female and mothers and fathers. However, I am open to the prospect that I could be mistaken. Similarly, while I agree with you on the other harms of colonialism you describe, I am not aware of any culture where it was not understood that there are two sexes.
Kind Regards
Karleen
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2022 12:22:35 +0200
> From: Lydia de Raad <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: Paper on use of sexed language in communication on maternity
>
> Hi Keyena,
>
> Thank you for your words. It would be helpful for me to know which country your are from?
>
> As to the paper presented, my eye fell on a sentence used by Karleen in her email:
>
> 'to avoid pitfalls and unintended consequences.'
>
> I have been wrecking my mind whát (which?) 'pitfalls and unintended consequences' that could be?
>
> As for the international perspective:
> I miss the cultures not using sexed language (Tagalog, parts of the Japanese cultural system), I miss the cultures/languages deliberately moving away from sexed pronouns (Scandinavia).
>
> Colonialism, either by the USA or by European countries (centuries befóre the USA) led to wiping out original cultures and putting the religious beliefs in place. Two sexes, nudity is inappropiate, and worshipping nature is a sin.
>
> Lydia, LLL-Leader, Netherlands (Europe)
>
>
>
>
>
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