> > > that we shift our focus with insecticide adverse > > effects away from honey bees (managed livestock) to "pollinators" > > in general. > > In the absense of field evidence of significant harm? Good question, Paul (somehow the above comment got sidetracked somehow to managed solitary and bumblebees). I wasn't claiming that there was evidence or not. but rather that on-the-ground evidence is what I'd be most interested in seeing (I find your videos of apparently healthy populations of native pollinators to be compelling). The issue that I was trying to address is that so long as EPA focuses only upon managed honey bees, then the implication is that so long as managed hives aren't present, then pesticide use need not be restricted. That then leads to one of two solutions-: 1. tell beekeepers to move their hives at the drop of a hat, or 2. to kick beekeepers off their locations. If we instead shift back to FIFRA's "no unreasonable risk to man or the environment," protection of pollinators in general would reduce the risk to the environment as a whole, since pollinators are an essential player in most terrestrial ecosystems. Since pollinators are not generally considered as "pests," and are generally considered as "beneficials," regulating pesticide use to protect their populations would seem to some of us to be entirely reasonable, even if the land upon which the pesticide was applied was privately owned. Regulation based upon honey bees as proxies for all pollinators is insufficient, due to the buffering capacity of the honey bee colony against pesticides. If instead, EPA were to regulate to protect pollinators in general, honey bees and beekeepers, as well as the remnants of natural ecosystems surviving in the margins of ag lands, would all benefit. -- Randy Oliver Grass Valley, CA www.ScientificBeekeeping.com *********************************************** The BEE-L mailing list is powered by L-Soft's renowned LISTSERV(R) list management software. For more information, go to: http://www.lsoft.com/LISTSERV-powered.html