On Sun, Nov 30, 2008 at 8:47 PM, Bob Harrison <[log in to unmask]>wrote:
: "Other than Stan ,Juanse and myself I do not know of any others on the
list
which have seen first hand losses."

Correction: My losses were from an other Bayer product, not based on
neonicotinoids . I suffer the losses under the hands of Sevin XR Plus, a
carbamat based insecticide.

This year I contacted the apple grower in my area. They were reluctant to
change their application schemes. In summ the different apple fields,
scheduled an application each other day for 10 days or so.

I finally got the first day of application date from the closest apple
grower and potencially the one that did the Bad Application from past year
episode (bee kill).

I could not stop them or get my hives out of the area. Blueberry I was
pollinating need some two more weeks to finnish bloom.

I was forced to change my plans in a catch 22. An cause each massive hive
intervention is the opportunity for an experiment I did one.

The question was: Was a bad application of a registered product or is the
product in itself?

Probably the answer up to now is the first one. I was expecting that if it
was a bad application, the pressure I made over the apple grower was enough
for them to be very carefull this season, and I will not suffer mayor losses
was my bet.

If it was the product in itself I will have mayor losses.

Instead of leaving all as it was, that was 300 full brood boxes and the
first super installed. Some of those super were half full by the first day
of application at fly range from my hives. I divided the operation in two
groups of  150 hives each.

To group A, I took out all capped_brood frames and one with honey/pollen
from the side. We filled those 4 to 6 frames we had taken out with drawn
comb from the suppers. All honey in the hive was given back well spread
between colonies of the same stand.

The idea was to lower the total population risk and to make new families to
replace the ones left. You know just in case.

We took out of the 150 group A hives = 250 new two frames families (plus a
v. queen we ad prepared ad hoc). We used as honey for those nucs, what we
have took out, plus "nosema contaminated honey frames" from the dead ones in
the winter/spring and we also supplement with 2 litres of liquid sucrose 67°
brix. Only on one of the 5 apiaries (50 hives each) the success was low. we
treated with amitraz those nucs after fecundations dates were over and mixed
the drone laying ones on 10 frames brood boxes with a queen right one.

We loked at The group A colonies again after 30 days of previous
manipulation. They have filled up the empty frames, capped the honey, latter
after the flow they changed honey for brood. .

After a month or so from the Sevin 2008 applications, we supered them and
took them to the mountain honey sites. No losses at all. The usual drone
layer or failed queen hives we added a nuc with newspaper paper before
moving it to the mountains.

 Group B was left as it was. 75% with a supper on. After a month the singles
were more than ready for a super or useless.

From group B we took only a barrel of honey: most of the queen had lay in
the supper. We moved them to the mountain sites at mid term of Tineo flow.
They filled a supper plus in 4 days.
 We placed a second and third super last friday.

I had a case in court to know a restricted report prepared by our
Agricultural Autorithy (AgA) about 2007 Sevin bee kill I had. The oposition
of this specific apple grower did not allowed the AgA  to facilitate me the
report.

There was a change in bloom dates between 2007 and 2008 season that could
have played in favour of the bees working other flower sources than apples
during the applications dates.

How ever, I am disgusted with Mr Bayer. After m mail, he mailed me back
asking for specific detail, and latter never again answer back my specific
questions. I insist that they trick and confuse the audience by playing with
convertions.

The case is self evident and Bayer, to be fair and keep their image
up, should help the beekeeper in this cases of bad application .

Justice is slow but should come. Some one had to pay for my losses, or at
least say sorry.


-- 
Juanse Barros J.
APIZUR S.A.
Carrera 695
Gorbea - CHILE
+56-45-271693
08-3613310
http://apiaraucania.blogspot.com/
[log in to unmask]

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