[log in to unmask] wrote:
>There were a lot of very helpful replies to my original question, which I
>am very grateful for. This is not one of them.  You see, just saying the
>problem is "the apparent weakened immune system" doesn't (a) tell me what
>is weakening the immune system, (b) tell me what I can do to find out what
>is weakening the immune system, or (c) suggest anything that I can do
>about it. 

Hello Tim,

Thanks for the kind encouragement, but you are quoting a post in which I
was talking to Chris, and is in NO way responding anything you asked!

Well, now you have gotten my attention,,,

You want me to name what is causing your problems???
Are you looking for Guesses?
 
Visit any hospital and ask them to name “the cause” of a weakened 
immune system.  

I doubt you will get a single cause! 
I doubt you will get a dozen causes! 
I doubt you will have the patience 
to sit and listen to them all!  

To answer you’re (a) , (b), (c) s. 

>(a) tell me what is weakening the immune system, 

The case in my area, ferals not fully recovered from the varroa 
crashes, there was less variance, and too few feral bees to have proper 
queen mating. The problem was exacerbated by the tendency for beekeepers 
in my area to import all sorts of strange strains of bees to cover their 
losses. Which IMO only served to hinder good breeding and the feral 
recovery.

Queens in Pennsylvania mating with too few drones that are from areas not 
northern adapted, are treatment dependant, varroa susceptible, and perhaps 
overly weighted by domestic breeding to the side of ‘industry’ at the 
expense of ‘survival traits‘, all made for a  sickly sub population of 
bees, incapable of sustaining itself.  
In short, disease, mites, not locally adapted, and poor mating,
will all weaken immune systems, at least I think it does in my area.

>(b) tell me what I can do to find out what is weakening the immune system

Just look at what’s making your bees look sickly,
What stands out the most?
Varroa? 
poor patterns?
Brood viability is below 95%?
Investigate, and compare with the ferals.
If the ferals are wipping your bees butts,
then would you think that would point to
a direction to follow?

(c) suggest anything that I can do
>about it. 

IMO, you need to rebuild the entire sub population to fitness,
or your yards, if they would happen to be so big.
The collapse of large groups of bees indicates the population is of a 
pitiful, miserable state of existence.  

For starters, I can suggest:

1. Trap ferals, focus on feral recovering areas, and bring them in for 
assessment.
2. Use a cell size of 5.1 or smaller to help pressure varroa
3. Test for hygienic behavior, (I culled anything not near 100%)
4. Set a goal to drop all treatments.
5. And settle on local adapted stock, or a single domestic line that
matches what types of ferals exist in your area.

Good Luck,
Joe

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