Allen said

> Anyhow, the point of this whole matter is simply that Alberta beekeeping
> does not prove anything in regard to neonics except that most bees do quite
> well on neonic treated canola in summer and if there is any effect, it is
> not *apparent*, especially as there is no way to compare and crops
> typically range widely from year to year and place to place.
>
>
I said

In fact the only documentation is that there is no *apparent* harm. That
> was posted several times by Peter as a result of studies done specifically
> to see what was actually happening in the field to commercial Canola
> pollinators.
>

So we agree.

I do not know anyone who said

That is not the same thing as saying there is no effect.
>

But I know many who agree with

 I simply do not know and neither can anyone else.
>

The problem is that we do not know what is the cause of bee losses that
seem out of the ordinary or if the losses are out of the ordinary. As you
noted a severe and long winter is a stressor.  But what causes the losses,
varroa, tracheal, nosema, virus, dysentary....? Both you and I lost all our
bees over winter several years ago. It was not the neonics but us.Who
knows, with some beekeepers more reticent to admit they were at fault, that
they might fit the blame on something else? It will not have set a
precedent.

What happens with an unknown is that it is too easy to blame, even if it is
not at fault, but it fits the narrative. I see this in Maine with
beekeepers blaming "CCD" even though is not a disease but a symptom. In
such cases it is almost always Varroa and the beekeepers lack of treatment.

Back to the neonics- With seed treated crops (except for the easily seen
problem of planter dust), it is difficult to pin the tail on that neonic
donkey.

Other treatment methods such as drenching do not appear to have "no
apparent harm",  but even there the picture is not clear. We are still in
the exploratory stage while many have already made their minds up. That is
not good science.

Bill Truesdell
Bath, Maine

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