>Not really - horses do not mate in free flight. Stallions and bulls are known to jump and/or crawl fences routinely. >As I said, the background population has more A.m.m. than other races. Even >in this heavily introgressed area, a recent study showed 42% A.m.m. mtDNA Seems that the bee can hold its own then, without the need to try to control others' practices. Interestingly, some studies have shown that bees of different strains from adjacent yards do not interbreed to nearly the extent we would expect. Timing of mating flights and many other factors apparently greatly reduce inter-mixing. > Man is rapidly altering a balance that has developed over thousands of years. I submit that this balance has always been influenced by man and that man may very well have introduced the bees in the first place. Is there proof to the contrary? I am always impressed by the variety we see in dogs and the huge range of characteristics that apparently result from human management. >Are we to judge a bee solely on the amount of honey that it produces? I suppose that depends on the individual. I doubt that anyone uses that narrow a screen, although I am sure most beekeepers rate that characteristic fairly highly. To me at this point, however, surplus honey is a nuisance, something that interferes with my enjoyment of my bees, and something I try to avoid producing. (Interestingly, I have that in common with those who produce bees and queens for sale and who also prefer bees which reproduce readily and not just at swarming season -- and do not make the boxes too heavy.) >appreciate that there are those on this list - we might say dominate this >list - who make or have made their full-time living from honey production >(and/or pollination) and that they might have their own values. Odd you would say that because I am sure an objective observer would see otherwise. The BEE-L mix includes several former commercial beekeepers, but also bee inspectors, scientists, regulators, an editor or two, a number of published writers and some organic producers as well as a healthy contingent of back-lot beekeepers. Maybe someone will expand the list. >I currently average 100lbs crop per hive based on autumn count Odd again that you should produce such a very round number. I always wonder how such numbers are summoned up. Not to suggest this is the case, but do I recall that our neighbouring province always reported their provincial average in numbers which ended in a zero (not two) and was always larger than Alberta's. Later we learned that they were a fiction concocted by phoning a number of large beekeepers and asking. As a fellow beekeeper said to me about beekeepers discussing yields: "First liar never had a chance". Of course, none of us would ever make numbers up, but I hear that 87.32% of all statistics are made up on the spot. Anyhow, Saskatchewan heavily controlled imports and movement of bees in the name of protecting from mites and other invaders while Alberta did not. At the end of the real-world experiment which began in 1986, we see that Alberta, where we deliberately avoided regulation and quarantines, but encouraged co-operation by showing leadership has continued to have a healthy expanding bee economy. On the other hand, Saskatchewan has steadily lost beekeepers, hive numbers, and production. That is what comes of attempting to promote bee health over the economic health of the industry, or did in this case. Other Canadian provinces, all of which were less free than Alberta have suffered declines, apparently in proportion to their regulatory load. Alberta alone has prospered. > Would moving to ligustica provide a better return... If so, should I do it > because I would make more money? This is rhetorical false alternative. Ligustica is not the only -- or necessarily reasonable choice, but there may be others which would enhance your stock. That seems to be the opinion of others who write me off-list but do not wish to be bombarded by rhetoric. > What would be the cost to the environment of producing that sugar for me to effectively turn into honey? Well, we cannot turn sugar into honey, but I know what you mean. Beekeepers do remove honey, then winter on sugar and I have long pondered the non-monetary economics of this. In some case, it is necessary since some honies would kill the bees over winter, but in most cases, bees would winter just fine on it. All that extra trucking, extracting, feeding, etc. consumes a great deal of energy and promotes the very mono-culture beekeepers abhor. >If personal gain is our only criterion then the world will be a poorer >place. I agree and thank you for this interesting debate. *********************************************** The BEE-L mailing list is powered by L-Soft's renowned LISTSERV(R) list management software. For more information, go to: http://www.lsoft.com/LISTSERV-powered.html Guidelines for posting to BEE-L can be found at: http://honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/guidelines.htm