Bill Pirkle wrote, in part re Beethoven's 4th Piano Concerto, 2nd mov:

>Who know whose right about this.  But I used the word "a struggle" for
>three reasons 1) the contrast between the two themes.  One, the 1st, is
>so incredibly powerful in its nature - almost vicious, and the 2nd so
>incredibly gentle.  2) the interplay between the two - the 1st, the 2nd,
>the 1st again, the 2nd again, then part of the 1st, then part of the 2nd,
>ect (this even happens at the end of the piece 3) the victory - after the
>initial struggle and starting at measure 31, the piano part dominates the
>piece for the next 34 measures(almost 1/2 the piece) to the end as if it
>won something.

In 3) above don't you mean measure 35&ff or -- better -- measure 47 &ff??

I'll not quibble.  Ain't worth it and I think we are closer in though than
it may appear.  My principal objection is to those who feel compelled to
attach a program to this music -- or to those who feel that such a ad hoc
program is delivered to them unbidden.

I rather imagine that Beethoven (in his marvelous and unique way) had in
mind a "struggle" between a strong (ff) 1st theme and a weaker (pp) 2nd
theme.  A masculine vs.  feminine theme.  (oops!  there I go upsetting the
feminist again!  Too bad.) His joy (I imagine to myself) was in playing
these two ideas off against each other with, of course, the weaker theme
winning.  He may also have intentionally placed a further limitation on
himself -- write this movement with only a piano, 1st and 2nd violins,
violas, cellos and basses, nothing more.  And even then, the 1st and 2nd
violins are playing in unison most - if not all - the time.

That was -- I like to think -- the challenge he set himself -- quite
consciously and with malice aforethought!  And he accomplished his
self-assigned task beautifully.  No female taming a male; no beauty
seducing her beast; no "good" conquering "evil"!!!

Beethoven was a musician, not a philosopher, after all.

Music doesn't have to "mean" anything.

Dave Pitzer