Went to see Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon at the cinema tonight. A fight
scene seemed to be in a potters workshop which contained some jars very
similar to the ilustrated one but with wider mouths and presumably
contemporary Chinese. It was in the dark so I couldn't see the fabric
clearly though it was brown looking. Also a great film.

paul courtney
leicester


----- Original Message -----
From: "Michiel Bartels" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2001 4:30 PM
Subject: Re: help with ceramic ID


> Well, this pot I'm afraid has a rather unusal shape for a Iberian amphora
of the
> 16-18th c. A flat base is pretty uncommon here, especially for this size.
The
> colour is too dark for Iberian material I think. Has the fabric any mica
in
> it???
> I agree with Paul Courtney that the provenance must be East Asia. It
indeed
> looks more like a martavan. The little 'eyes' (four or six) are missing on
the
> shoulder though, it has no obvious impressed mark and not a good glaze.
Wonder
> what the fabric is?
> As earlier said, could it be Korean or Vietnamese?
> Some nice Chinese and Vietnamese examples can be found in the Japanese
book'
> Unearthed cities' (Tokyo 1996) with a.o. the digs from Nagasaki and Tokyo.
They
> don't have exactly  the same shape and decoration though.
>
> Michiel Bartels
> Amsterdam NL
>
> paul.courtney2 schreef:
>
> > The pot looks rather like the Martavan stoneware storage jars produced
in
> > China and SE Asia. The only pictures I have are of C17 examples but the
> > tradition may have continued on.
> >
> > paul courtney
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 5:43 PM
> > Subject: Re: help with ceramic ID
> >
> > > Dave:
> > >
> > > I did some archeological work in Sitka back in the early 1980's, so
spent
> > a
> > > lot of time reading up on the Russians in Alaska. Following up on Ron
> > May's
> > > observation that your jar looks like a Spanish olive jar recycled as a
> > > water jar: the Russian American Company suffered throughout its tenure
in
> > > Alaska from poor supply networks to Russia. My excavations in Sitka
> > yielded
> > > mostly British material culture, because the Russians depended heavily
on
> > > the Hudson's Bay Company for supplies. They also had some trade
agreements
> > > with the Spanish before the Mexican Revolution, and their settlement
at
> > > Fort Ross in California provided much of the foodstuffs for the
Alaskan
> > > outposts.
> > >
> > > It is very likely that your jar came to Alaska via the Russian
American
> > > Company, through their Fort Ross settlement and trade agreements with
the
> > > Spanish.
> > >
> > > Let me know if you need some specific references to follow-up. I know
> > Glenn
> > > Ferris, for instance, has done a lot of archeological work at Fort
Ross,
> > > and may be able to steer you down that path, if you like.
> > >
> > >
> > > Cathy Spude
> > > (aka Cathy Blee)
> > > [log in to unmask]
> > >
>